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Old 07-15-2008, 06:11 PM   #16
Molson
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Default Re: Why the hell isn't Bargnani taking part in summerleague?

The summer league is for all of TEN days.

He should be in the summer league AND practicing with the team AND working out at big man camp.

I don't see how he can't at least play in those games to practice what he is working on.

10 days gentlemen. We're not talking about an entire month. At the very least he shoudl be playing half the games and using those game situations to work on what he is learning at the practices.

I personally think he is not in there because Coangelo is worried he may not do well hurting his confidence and maybe his value.
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Old 07-15-2008, 08:42 PM   #17
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Default Re: Why the hell isn't Bargnani taking part in summerleague?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Molson
The summer league is for all of TEN days.

He should be in the summer league AND practicing with the team AND working out at big man camp.

I don't see how he can't at least play in those games to practice what he is working on.

10 days gentlemen. We're not talking about an entire month. At the very least he shoudl be playing half the games and using those game situations to work on what he is learning at the practices.

I personally think he is not in there because Coangelo is worried he may not do well hurting his confidence and maybe his value.


I agree totally. He's not playing so he doesn't get exposed. Not sure about hurting his value, as I doubt BC will move him unfortunately, but definitely worried about him getting abused in the SL and losing all confidence. Not good.
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Old 07-15-2008, 08:46 PM   #18
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Default Re: Why the hell isn't Bargnani taking part in summerleague?

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Originally Posted by BrownBaller

b) Thorton and Bargs would never really matchup cause Bargs being a 3 doesnt work. Brandan Wright played 1/4 of the minutes Bargs played, THATS why he's in the summer league to get some run because come regular season Wright is sitting on the bench (O'Bryant Syndrome) again because of the Randolph hype and Don Nelson's disgust for anything over 6'7 on that team.

So Wright will sit on the bench b/c he's over 6'7" but Randolph won't? Wright, Noah, Thorton, Amir, Stuckey....all good players that are playing. So should Bargs. There is plenty of time to work on drills and then implement them in a game situation. You don't think Noah is also practicing on the side?
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Old 07-15-2008, 10:35 PM   #19
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Default Re: Why the hell isn't Bargnani taking part in summerleague?

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Originally Posted by RapsFan
Couldn't the same be said for Joey Graham?

Bargnani should be in the summer league 100%. Guys like Noah and Brandon Wright are playing, so should he.

My guess is that in the wake of the Summer Olympics, he doesn't want to be too tired. The other guys you mentioned won't make it to their national team even if their lives depended on it. Bargnani has a lot on his shoulders in August. Also, remember that it's not too long after the Olympics that the training camp starts. He needs his rest.
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Old 07-16-2008, 12:15 AM   #20
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Default Re: Why the hell isn't Bargnani taking part in summerleague?

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Originally Posted by RapsFan
So Wright will sit on the bench b/c he's over 6'7" but Randolph won't? Wright, Noah, Thorton, Amir, Stuckey....all good players that are playing. So should Bargs. There is plenty of time to work on drills and then implement them in a game situation. You don't think Noah is also practicing on the side?

lets see...randolph is the same player and he is out playing wright...i think wright is safe to be on the pine, and yes al harrington was another good player who was basically relegated to 3 point shooting in nellies offense...Noah shows some balls in the post and rebounds more than like 2-3 a game....stuckey isnt playing anymore..i cant believe u said Amir was good....wowwww is all i have to say good sir.
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Old 07-16-2008, 01:02 AM   #21
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Default Re: Why the hell isn't Bargnani taking part in summerleague?

Italy won't even be in the Olympics though. That's not an issue.

If it is the whole "confidence" thing, sparing him if he happens to play poorly then that is really worrisome because Andrea Bargnani just might be the most mentally soft player in the league.

I really think Bargnani is gone at the trade deadline if the Raptors appear to be somewhat legit contenders. A team with no hope of contending trades away their good veteran SG (Mike Miller? Jason Richardson? even maybe Vince Carter?) for Bargnani's potential plus whatever filler is necessary (Kapono, Graham, Parker). Then the Raptors fill out the frontcourt with one of the solid veterans that is always available.
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Old 07-16-2008, 01:22 AM   #22
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Default Re: Why the hell isn't Bargnani taking part in summerleague?

What happened to working out with john lucas? is that who's he's working out with right now? Getting confused since the JO conference when O'Neal said he was looking forward to working with Bargs in Vegas.
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Old 07-16-2008, 02:50 AM   #23
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Default Re: Why the hell isn't Bargnani taking part in summerleague?

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Originally Posted by Qwyjibo
Italy won't even be in the Olympics though. That's not an issue.

If it is the whole "confidence" thing, sparing him if he happens to play poorly then that is really worrisome because Andrea Bargnani just might be the most mentally soft player in the league.

I really think Bargnani is gone at the trade deadline if the Raptors appear to be somewhat legit contenders. A team with no hope of contending trades away their good veteran SG (Mike Miller? Jason Richardson? even maybe Vince Carter?) for Bargnani's potential plus whatever filler is necessary (Kapono, Graham, Parker). Then the Raptors fill out the frontcourt with one of the solid veterans that is always available.
Damn ****ing straight. Bargnani has to be good for us coming off the bench (12ppg MINIMUM, with improved defense and rebounding) or he should be gone before the trade deadline in exchange for an actual NBA player.
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Old 07-16-2008, 03:15 AM   #24
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Default Re: Why the hell isn't Bargnani taking part in summerleague?

I don't even care what his total PPG is as long as he can be even somewhat efficient on offense and show some competence on D and the boards. Those are INCREDIBLY low standards for a 1st overall pick going into his 3rd season but that's the reality here.

I say that because Bargnani managed to only average 24 minutes per game behind Bosh (36 mpg) and Rasho (21 mpg). Now it'll be Bosh once again but I highly doubt Jermaine O'Neal will be playing anything less that 30 minutes per game. Bargnani certainly isn't a better option at SF than either Moon or Kapono either so there will be a lot less minutes available to him.
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Old 07-16-2008, 01:20 PM   #25
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Default Re: Why the hell isn't Bargnani taking part in summerleague?

I hope after the last two quality posts that we don't see Bokes come back insisting Bargs plays the summer league. Everything the Raptors have said before the last season ended was that Bargs needed work. Work that is not posible with the current NBA structure of generating money playing 82 games a season, not counting the pre-season or the post season. Not even mentioning the restrictions each team has on practise time. Every coach says that they don't have enough practise time, and Bokee thinks Bargs will improve by playing the summer league!! Read up Bokee, this is not new.

Bargs need's work and the big man camp would be worth the first two weeks of the season, let alone the off season.
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Old 07-16-2008, 03:55 PM   #26
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Default Re: Why the hell isn't Bargnani taking part in summerleague?

Quote:
Originally Posted by BrownBaller
lets see...randolph is the same player and he is out playing wright...i think wright is safe to be on the pine, and yes al harrington was another good player who was basically relegated to 3 point shooting in nellies offense...Noah shows some balls in the post and rebounds more than like 2-3 a game....stuckey isnt playing anymore..i cant believe u said Amir was good....wowwww is all i have to say good sir.

Do you actually watch basketball? Noah got over 7 bds per as a starter in less then 30 mins as a rookie. Stuckey is way past Bargnani and he participated. Amir Johnson is one of the most sought after big man prospects in the league. Wright is getting like 14/6/2blks on 64% FG in the summer. You can't believe I said Amir Johnson....non Raptor fans probably couldn't believe I said Bargnani.

Bottom line, Bargnani needs a ton of work so if the Raps think he's best served working in the gym then fine. I would have liked to see him participate against some of the leagues other young players, but I think losing confidence if he got destroyed would be a worry.
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Old 07-16-2008, 07:48 PM   #27
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Default Re: Why the hell isn't Bargnani taking part in summerleague?

Quote:
Originally Posted by RapsFan
Do you actually watch basketball? Noah got over 7 bds per as a starter in less then 30 mins as a rookie. Stuckey is way past Bargnani and he participated. Amir Johnson is one of the most sought after big man prospects in the league. Wright is getting like 14/6/2blks on 64% FG in the summer. You can't believe I said Amir Johnson....non Raptor fans probably couldn't believe I said Bargnani.

Bottom line, Bargnani needs a ton of work so if the Raps think he's best served working in the gym then fine. I would have liked to see him participate against some of the leagues other young players, but I think losing confidence if he got destroyed would be a worry.

LOL are you serious?!?! Joey Graham averages like 18-20 ppg in the summer league like wright and yaa i can see u watch basketball thinking they both had an impact in the reg. season... I maybe if you could read full posts instead of blabbin off, i said Noah has balls in the post, he has some post skill to build on in summer league, Bargs doesn't. and yes Stuckey is way past Bargs, also why i would have him in 5 on 5 not Bargs, like everyone has been saying on this topic, Bargs needs fundamentals before anything.

I'm also glad some people are open to trade Bargs, i feel that if it doesn't work out we can still sell high on his "potential" and get something that can contribute right away if we're in a position to go deep in the playoffs

and seriously? people want johnson?? i didnt even know/hear nothing about it ..he's not even making much noise
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Old 07-16-2008, 09:19 PM   #28
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Default Re: Why the hell isn't Bargnani taking part in summerleague?

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Originally Posted by BrownBaller
LOL are you serious?!?! Joey Graham averages like 18-20 ppg in the summer league like wright and yaa i can see u watch basketball thinking they both had an impact in the reg. season... I maybe if you could read full posts instead of blabbin off, i said Noah has balls in the post, he has some post skill to build on in summer league, Bargs doesn't. and yes Stuckey is way past Bargs, also why i would have him in 5 on 5 not Bargs, like everyone has been saying on this topic, Bargs needs fundamentals before anything.

and seriously? people want johnson?? i didnt even know/hear nothing about it ..he's not even making much noise

This first paragraph is barely coherent.

Why you are comparing Joey Graham to Brandon Wright is beyond me. I never said Graham had any impact and he won't. Brandon has way less miles then Graham, and Brandon will in fact be a factor in the near future. He is playing and getting better in the summer.

Sounds like we're in agreement that Noah is better then Bargs...but he's playing in the summer too, getting better.

It's such a warped logic that people think Bargs is so terrible that he can't improve by playing in games. That he needs to work on such basic things in practice against pylons, assistant coaches, coat racks and such,that he's not even capable of playing in a game situation. If that is in fact true, that is the most hilarious, and pathetic situation possible. He's gone from #1 overall pick, to not being able to hold his own in an exhibition game. We're in more trouble then I thought then.

And yes, Amir Johnson is basically untouchable, along with Stuckey, for the Pistons. Think of how the Wiz view Blatche...similar.
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Old 07-16-2008, 09:26 PM   #29
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Default Re: Why the hell isn't Bargnani taking part in summerleague?

Quote:
Originally Posted by b4ball
I hope after the last two quality posts that we don't see Bokes come back insisting Bargs plays the summer league. Everything the Raptors have said before the last season ended was that Bargs needed work. Work that is not posible with the current NBA structure of generating money playing 82 games a season, not counting the pre-season or the post season. Not even mentioning the restrictions each team has on practise time. Every coach says that they don't have enough practise time, and Bokee thinks Bargs will improve by playing the summer league!! Read up Bokee, this is not new.

Bargs need's work and the big man camp would be worth the first two weeks of the season, let alone the off season.
Bargs was half decent, emphasis on HALF decent in his first year, and somehow he menaged to DECLINE in his second year... I don't care how much talk comes from the Raps camp about how Bargs needs improvement. Talk is cheap. I personally am not satisfied until I see results... until I see him on the court and see that he's improved significantly. But hey, I have the problem of liking GOOD players. my bad.
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Old 07-17-2008, 12:02 AM   #30
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Default Re: Why the hell isn't Bargnani taking part in summerleague?

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Originally Posted by bokes15
Bargs was half decent, emphasis on HALF decent in his first year, and somehow he menaged to DECLINE in his second year... I don't care how much talk comes from the Raps camp about how Bargs needs improvement. Talk is cheap. I personally am not satisfied until I see results... until I see him on the court and see that he's improved significantly. But hey, I have the problem of liking GOOD players. my bad.

its not that he's not "good" per say, its that he wastes a truck load off talent because of confidence issues. You don't get paid millions of dollars to suddenly realize you're scared of playing up to your hype
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