UFC 117 - August 7 (Silva vs. Sonnen)

[lakers_forever]

I can't help but to really dislike the guys that rely on jiu-jitsu after getting their @sses beat for over four rounds... That was some Gracie sh!t. It drove me nuts then and it still does.

You should watch K-1 and boxing only then. This is MMA. That Gracie sh!t was what basically made the sport of MMA.

[IcanzIIravor]

GTFOH! I stayed as long as I could and was late to work missing the last minute and the Spider pulled it off?!?! That was an action packed fight. Props to Sonnen. I agree he shouldn't get an immediate rematch, but if he wins his next fight he should get to face th Spider again should Anderson win his next one. Props to Sonnen for backing up his talk, but for a last minute mistake. Great fight.

[-playmaker-]

That wasn't a comeback. That was slipping and falling into the win.

Getting your ass beat for 3 or 4 rounds, then outworking someone in the 5th and getting the win is.
well it was shocking...call it what you want

[Poodle]

silva sonnen was awesome. the kick/punch count must've been 50 - 1000, all of those little punches he got in, sonnen never stopped throwing the whole 5 rounds :wtf:

Silva had some terrible take down defense. he got better at the end but looks like Sonnen can usually get him. then dominate him on the ground from there.

just proves anyone can get caught and lose. BJJ ftw.

[Done_And_Done]

It wasn't 'just' ground-and-pound that Sonnen was dominating. He also got the better of Silva in the standup... By rocking him a few times and taking him down at will.

I can't help but to really dislike the guys that rely on jiu-jitsu after getting their @sses beat for over four rounds... That was some Gracie sh!t. It drove me nuts then and it still does.


That's pin point vintage Royce right there.

Sonnen was a minute and change away from instantly transforming himself into a household name and he got bit by a Gracie'esq out from nowhere type finish...

You can cut the drama with a spork

[IcanzIIravor]

HE just kept him on the ground cuz he a wrestler.
His punches were doing ZERO damage!


Bowdown To King Silva
http://themoderatevoice.com/wordpress-engine/files/2009-january/bow_down.gif

Zero damage? I didn't see Anderson walking through those punches. Did we watch the same fight?

[RedBlackAttack]

I am sure Silva will have a much better game plan going into a rematch...

I will take Silva...

honestly, I just didn't see a sense of urgency from him at all tonight...I don't expect that from him again...
I'm not sure what a sense of urgency would have done to stop those takedowns... Or to counter Sonnen's excellent hip control on top. In fact, urgency can be counter-productive against guys like that.

It was only Silva's calm demeanor that allowed him to stick that triangle at the end. A more desperate fighter would have tried something crazy when it wasn't there and found themselves in even worse shape.

Sonnen is a GREAT matchup for Silva. That should be clear... And there absolutely should be a rematch.

[Brujesino]

Here are my picks for the awards of the night

Fight of the Night
Anderson Silva vs Chael Sonnen

Submission of the Night
Anderson Silva

KO of the Night
Stefan Struve

I think they are pretty much easy choices.

[GOBB]

The ref would have stopped the fight,chael would have lost regardless.Lose with a healthy arm or lose with a broken arm?pretty easy choice.

Well why didnt he realize what Silva was doing before he locked up the arm and just got up or let him go? I'm trying to understand what Sonnen could have did to avoid that. I mean you knew it was coming because Silva was trying at the end of every round. His corner should have yelled let him go so they stand up. Dude was tapping the hell out of Silva jaw. Take my chances with time running out that way.

[pethuel03]

Silva got worked. He did nothing this fight besides get lucky at the end. He got buckled and ate fists standing up. He got owned on the ground. His corner was crying at Silva for not doing anything. Silva fanboys were crying "Omg he didnt train" lining up excuses. Dude even got BOOO and no Philly fans were in attendance. The better fighter didnt win tonight. That happens in sports. Someone translate that to Anderson Silva and his fans!

No I understand that. I am saying it is just funny that when sonnen was beating silva's ass, many people are already dumping silva as if the fight is over. Then when Silva submitted sonnen, these people were making lazy arguments and becoming mad like "OMG HE DIDNT TAP" hahaha.. Its so funny.. :roll: :roll: :roll:

[heyhey]

once the fighting mode and adrenaline wears out

sonnen's gonna sit down, think about the fight.. and well from there, i would not want to be near him...

why? Chael sonnen should be thanking the lord that he caught Silva with a rib injury. healthy silva would KTFO sonnen out in round 1. Sonnen got hte fight of his life and did the very best he could but he still lost cause Silva is just the better fighter period.

I bet Chael loses MUCH easier next fight.

[-playmaker-]

I'm not sure what a sense of urgency would have done to stop those takedowns... Or to counter Sonnen's excellent hip control on top. In fact, urgency can be counter-productive against guys like that.

It was only Silva's calm demeanor that allowed him to stick that triangle at the end. A more desperate fighter would have tried something crazy when it wasn't there and found themselves in even worse shape.

Sonnen is a GREAT matchup for Silva. That should be clear... And there absolutely should be a rematch.
Silva is EXTREMELY hard to take down...infact I can't even remember the last time I have seen someone take down Silva...

[IcanzIIravor]

Well why didnt he realize what Silva was doing before he locked up the arm and just got up or let him go? I'm trying to understand what Sonnen could have did to avoid that. I mean you knew it was coming because Silva was trying at the end of every round. His corner should have yelled let him go so they stand up. Dude was tapping the hell out of Silva jaw. Take my chances with time running out that way.

My guess is he got caught up in the moment and wanted to finish the fight instead of stepping back and protecting himself. He wanted to take it to the champ until the end and learned a tough lesson. You did enough to please the boss and the crowd, get the hell out of harms way and cruise to the title.

[RedBlackAttack]

Silva is EXTREMELY hard to take down...infact I can't even remember the last time I have seen someone take down Silva...
He has never gone against a world-class wrestler on the level of Sonnen in his prime and conditioned. And, no... He isn't extremely difficult to take down for a guy like that. Sonnen was tossing him all over the place, even from his back.

Sonnen's combination of grappling and conditioning is FAR better than anyone Anderson has faced.

[Brujesino]

Silva is EXTREMELY hard to take down...infact I can't even remember the last time I have seen someone take down Silva...
hes only fought 2 wreslters in he UFC Dan Henderson who took him down and Chael Sonnen you saw what he did to him.

Damian mai is not a wreslter and couldnt take him down,Leites is not a wrestler and couldnt take him down everyone else Silva has fought have been strikers.

Silva struggles with wreslters but in the end his ju jitsu prevails.

[GOBB]

No I understand that. I am saying it is just funny that when sonnen was beating silva's ass, many people are already dumping silva as if the fight is over. Then when Silva submitted sonnen, these people were making lazy arguments and becoming mad like "OMG HE DIDNT TAP" hahaha.. Its so funny.. :roll: :roll: :roll:

Yeah he definately tapped and I saw it coming. I was mad dude tapped. If I was his corner I would have punched him in the back of the head. This was one of those losses where you just want to snatch the ethernet cord out your xbox playing an online ranked match. Its one of those losses where after you lose someone asks you something and you snap.

"Yo GOBB I'm ordering Chinese. Want me to get you something"

GOBB "Yo shut the f*ck up, damn!"

"Whats your problem yo?"

GOBB "U asking dumb questions and shyt."

"Alrighty then"

The type of loss you can get Tourettes syndrome from. Just blurt out shyt after a loss where you clearly had it won. This is like playing Call of Duty Modern Warfare 2 and someone shooting you in your face for the game winning kill. And all you can say is "F*cking camping f@ggot! Lag switching having cheater. Ur weak.". I mean all the guy did was beat you to the punch and shot you in your face. But dying sucks especially being the game winning kill for the lobby to see.

[-playmaker-]

He has never wrestled a world-class wrestler on the level of Sonnen. And, no... He isn't extremely difficult to take down for a guy like that. Sonnen was tossing him all over the place, even from his back.
and that is why I don't think Silva showed up as Silva...

it isn't like Silva hasn't faced wrestlers...Sonnen made something look easy that no one else ever has...


could someone even tell me the last time Silva was taken down?....back like 5 years ago or some shit before his prime days?

[heyhey]

He has never gone against a world-class wrestler on the level of Sonnen in his prime and conditioned. And, no... He isn't extremely difficult to take down for a guy like that. Sonnen was tossing him all over the place, even from his back.

Sonnen's combination of grappling and conditioning is FAR better than anyone Anderson has faced.

the only reason sonnen was taking silva down was cause silva got rocked early on in first round. after that you can plainly tell that silva was disoriented which affected his TDD.

THe only times Silva has been easy to takedown were when he was injured. Vs Lutter and now vs. Sonnen.

Healthy Silva kills sonnen. Fact

[IcanzIIravor]

Yeah he definately tapped and I saw it coming. I was mad dude tapped. If I was his corner I would have punched him in the back of the head. This was one of those losses where you just want to snatch the ethernet cord out your xbox playing an online ranked match. Its one of those losses where after lose someone asks you something and you snap.

"Yo GOBB I'm ordering Chinese. Want me to get you something"

GOBB "Yo shut the f*ck up, damn!"

"Whats your problem yo?"

GOBB "U asking dumb questions and shyt."

"Alrighty then"

The type of loss you can get Tourettes syndrome from. Just blurt out shyt after a loss where you clearly had it won. This is like playing Call of Duty Modern Warfare 2 and someone shooting you in your face for the game winning kill. And all you can say is "F*cking camping f@ggot! Lag switching having cheater. Ur weak.".


:roll: :roll: :roll:

[Brujesino]

Well why didnt he realize what Silva was doing before he locked up the arm and just got up or let him go? I'm trying to understand what Sonnen could have did to avoid that. I mean you knew it was coming because Silva was trying at the end of every round. His corner should have yelled let him go so they stand up. Dude was tapping the hell out of Silva jaw. Take my chances with time running out that way.
Every single one of Chaels loses have come from submissions,more specifiaclly Triangle chokes like today.

He doesnt train in ju jitsu because hes republican and that not was what republicans do.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gG0v1ZVxItg

[-playmaker-]

hes only fought 2 wreslters in he UFC Dan Henderson who took him down and Chael Sonnen you saw what he did to him.

Damian mai is not a wreslter and couldnt take him down,Leites is not a wrestler and couldnt take him down everyone else Silva has fought have been strikers.

Silva struggles with wreslters but in the end his ju jitsu prevails.
Henderson took him down?

[IcanzIIravor]

the only reason sonnen was taking silva down was cause silva got rocked early on in first round. after that you can plainly tell that silva was disoriented which affected his TDD.

THe only times Silva has been easy to takedown were when he was injured. Vs Lutter and now vs. Sonnen.

Healthy Silva kills sonnen. Fact

That's not a fact. That's an opinion. While I think a healthy Silva wins to say he'd kill Sonnen after watching this fight is laughable.

[-playmaker-]

oh yes, henderson did take him down...that's right

[Done_And_Done]

Yeah he definately tapped and I saw it coming. I was mad dude tapped. If I was his corner I would have punched him in the back of the head. This was one of those losses where you just want to snatch the ethernet cord out your xbox playing an online ranked match. .


Dope Analogy...

[Jailblazers7]

Yeah he definately tapped and I saw it coming. I was mad dude tapped. If I was his corner I would have punched him in the back of the head. This was one of those losses where you just want to snatch the ethernet cord out your xbox playing an online ranked match. Its one of those losses where after lose someone asks you something and you snap.

"Yo GOBB I'm ordering Chinese. Want me to get you something"

GOBB "Yo shut the f*ck up, damn!"

"Whats your problem yo?"

GOBB "U asking dumb questions and shyt."

"Alrighty then"

The type of loss you can get Tourettes syndrome from. Just blurt out shyt after a loss where you clearly had it won. This is like playing Call of Duty Modern Warfare 2 and someone shooting you in your face for the game winning kill. And all you can say is "F*cking camping f@ggot! Lag switching having cheater. Ur weak.". I mean all the guy did was beat you to the punch and shot you in your face. But dying sucks especially being the game winning kill for the lobby to see.

:oldlol:

In that situation, I would probably be about to punch my tv but realize it could break so instead I would either give myself a charlie horse or punch something worthless to avoid any valuables being destroyed.

[Positive]

Yeah he definately tapped and I saw it coming. I was mad dude tapped. If I was his corner I would have punched him in the back of the head. This was one of those losses where you just want to snatch the ethernet cord out your xbox playing an online ranked match. Its one of those losses where after you lose someone asks you something and you snap.

"Yo GOBB I'm ordering Chinese. Want me to get you something"

GOBB "Yo shut the f*ck up, damn!"

"Whats your problem yo?"

GOBB "U asking dumb questions and shyt."

"Alrighty then"

The type of loss you can get Tourettes syndrome from. Just blurt out shyt after a loss where you clearly had it won. This is like playing Call of Duty Modern Warfare 2 and someone shooting you in your face for the game winning kill. And all you can say is "F*cking camping f@ggot! Lag switching having cheater. Ur weak.". I mean all the guy did was beat you to the punch and shot you in your face. But dying sucks especially being the game winning kill for the lobby to see.


:roll: :roll: :roll:

that's so true...

[Brujesino]

I still think if silvas ribs were not hurt the fight would have been the same.

[Done_And_Done]

:oldlol:

In that situation, I would probably be about to punch my tv but realize it could break so instead I would either give myself a charlie horse or punch something worthless to avoid any valuables being destroyed.


lol @ the visual of giving a self inflicted charlie horse

[Jailblazers7]

lol @ the visual of giving a self inflicted charlie horse

A mans gotta do what a mans gotta do to save his tv or xbox controller lol.

[RedBlackAttack]

and that is why I don't think Silva showed up as Silva...

it isn't like Silva hasn't faced wrestlers...Sonnen made something look easy that no one else ever has...


could someone even tell me the last time Silva was taken down?....back like 5 years ago or some shit before his prime days?
Once again... The reason Sonnen was able to do things that no one else has is because he has a wrestling pedigree that no one on Silva's resume has. Even Dan Henderson, as great as a wrestler as he is, does not come close to the takedown artist that Sonnen is.

Henderson was more of a throw/Greco Roman guy as a wrestler. Sonnen was a master of the takedown.

If there is a rematch, you will see Sonnen doing the same thing to Silva... Taking him down at will. It will come down to Silva either landing something hard in the standup or catching Sonnen in a submission, but he WILL NOT stop those takedowns.... And he will also have no answer for Sonnen's hip control from the top and bottom positions. THAT is what a world-class wrestler does.

[mattevans11]

:oldlol:

In that situation, I would probably be about to punch my tv but realize it could break so instead I would either give myself a charlie horse or punch something worthless to avoid any valuables being destroyed.


THis was hilarious..... smart enough to not hit the tv, and say "it would be better to hit myself in the thigh"

please tell me you have done this before.

this visual cracked me up. this will be repped if i can do it

[-playmaker-]

your a fool
"YOU'RE" a fool...


YOU


ARE


a


fool

Go get drunk, its the only thing your good at.



"YOU'RE"....:hammerhead:


you stupid f*ck...

take the day off from mowing my lawn tomorrow and go get a degree...

[-playmaker-]

Once again... The reason Sonnen was able to do things that no one else has is because he has a wrestling pedigree that no one on Silva's resume has. Even Dan Henderson, as great as a wrestler as he is, does not come close to the takedown artist that Sonnen is.

Henderson was more of a throw/Greco Roman guy as a wrestler. Sonnen was a master of the takedown.

If there is a rematch, you will see Sonnen doing the same thing to Silva... Taking him down at will. It will come down to Silva either landing something hard in the standup or catching Sonnen in a submission, but he WILL NOT stop those takedowns.... And he will also have no answer for Sonnen's hip control from the top and bottom positions. THAT is what a world-class wrestler does.
and you determined this just from that fight right?..where Silva wa dazed and confused...

If we see a rematch I bet it won't be like that at all...

infact, we can avy bet when it happen....

[RedBlackAttack]

and you determined this just from that fight right?..where Silva wa dazed and confused...

If we see a rematch I bet it won't be like that at all...

infact, we can avy bet when it happen....
:oldlol:

No... Take a look at Sonnen's collegiate wrestling resume and post-collegiate wrestling resume and compare it to others that Silva has fought. It really isn't even close. The only guy close is Henderson and he took down Silva, as well.

You are telling me that Silva was dazed for 4 1/2 rounds and that is why Sonnen was taking him down with EASE time and again? I saw a couple of decent punches landed by Sonnen, but nothing that would cause Silva to be 'out of it' enough to be completely unable to defend the takedown.

He couldn't defend it because Sonnen is a FAR superior grappler. It really isn't even debatable.

And, like I said, I saw Sonnen wrestle up close and personal when he was at Oregon. He is a world-class wrestler and I've known about him for over a decade.

[Jailblazers7]

THis was hilarious..... smart enough to not hit the tv, and say "it would be better to hit myself in the thigh"

please tell me you have done this before.

this visual cracked me up. this will be repped if i can do it

Oh, I've done it on multiple occasions. Whether it be a last second loss on Madden or dying on COD, it's better to have a bruise on the thigh than a broken tv. :oldlol:

[-playmaker-]

:oldlol:

No... Take a look at Sonnen's collegiate wrestling resume and post-collegiate wrestling resume and compare it to others that Silva has fought. It really isn't even close. The only guy close is Henderson and he took down Silva, as well.

You are telling me that Silva was dazed for 4 1/2 rounds and that is why Sonnen was taking him down with EASE time and again? I saw a couple of decent punches landed by Sonnen, but nothing that would cause Silva to be 'out of it' enough to be completely unable to defend the takedown.

He couldn't defend it because Sonnen is a FAR superior grappler. It really isn't even debatable.

And, like I said, I saw Sonnen wrestle up close and personal when he was at Oregon. He is a world-class wrestler and I've known about him for over a decade.
Sonnen probably is the greatest wrestler Silva ha ever seen...

and no, I don't think he was dazed more than a round or 2...

BUT what I am telling you is that I don't believe the Silva I saw tonight was the same Silva I am used to seeing...that is all...

maybe he was prepared, maybe he didn't care, maybe he didn't do his homework...(maybe he is out of his prime, noooo)....that is all I am saying

and if they rematch I will take Silva...

[mattevans11]

Oh, I've done it on multiple occasions. Whether it be a last second loss on Madden or dying on COD, it's better to have a bruise on the thigh than a broken tv. :oldlol:


yeah but you are obviously saying you cant do that cause the consequence, then puch yourself in the leg.... haha, if you are able to stop doing the other then just wait till you can do soemthing with no lasting consequence, like punch a couch,,,,

[GOBB]

BUT what I am telling you is that I don't believe the Silva I saw tonight was the same Silva I am used to seeing...that is all...

So instead you turn to excuses "He didnt take this fight seriously. He didnt train" instead of acknowledging Silva may just have trouble vs certain fighters like wrestlers? You allow your fandom of a team or player get in the way of things.

[IcanzIIravor]

Sonnen probably is the greatest wrestler Silva ha ever seen...

and no, I don't think he was dazed more than a round or 2...

BUT what I am telling you is that I don't believe the Silva I saw tonight was the same Silva I am used to seeing...that is all...

maybe he was prepared, maybe he didn't care, maybe he didn't do his homework...(maybe he is out of his prime, noooo)....that is all I am saying

and if they rematch I will take Silva...

I'll take Silva too, but he won't kill Sonnen like some people here think.

[Brujesino]

"YOU'RE"....:hammerhead:


you stupid f*ck...

take the day off from mowing my lawn tomorrow and go get a degree...
Your sill a dumb drunken b!tch.

Good luck fixing your asshole when the raiders **** the cowboys in ass next week.

I was already takin the day off anyways you b!tch.

[-playmaker-]

So instead you turn to excuses "He didnt take this fight seriously. He didnt train" instead of acknowledging Silva may just have trouble vs certain fighters like wrestlers? You allow your fandom of a team or player get in the way of things.
no it is obvious that Sonnen's style gives him issues...and I don't need to make excuses, Silva won...but he just didn't looked like he cared to me...that is all...

[-playmaker-]

Your sill a dumb drunken b!tch.

Good luck fixing your asshole when the raiders **** the cowboys in ass next week.

I was already takin the day off anyways you b!tch.
:sleeping



"still"

[-playmaker-]

:sleeping











....................

[Jailblazers7]

Talking shit about a preseason game? New low.

[GOBB]

no it is obvious that Sonnen's style gives him issues...and I don't need to make excuses, Silva won...but he just didn't looked like he cared to me...that is all...

Right because you didnt make excuses during the fight when Silva was on his back for most of it? :rolleyes:

[Brujesino]

Talking shit about a preseason game? New low.
Sadly,yes.

[Jailblazers7]

Sadly,yes.

I guess that what happens when you are a Raiders fan. :oldlol:

[-playmaker-]

Right because you didnt make excuses during the fight when Silva was on his back for most of it? :rolleyes:
I was saying the same thing then that I am now...Silva looked like he didn't give a f*ck...

that is just how it looked to me...and it is no excuse

maybe he trained like it was the fight of his life, but it sure didn't look that way to me...

[Zombles]

Hoooolyyyy shit what a night of fights, epic knockout comeback by Struve, Dos Santos did what we expected though props to Roy for hanging in there. The Guida fight was entertaining while it lasted and :applause: to Fitch for manhandling the larger, stronger Alves like that.

And hoooolyyyyy shit what a main event. Sonnen was the first fighter in a long time that wasn't scared of Anderson coming into the ring and it showed with that left cross that buckled Silva in the first. Silva literally won a minute of that fight, the standup barrage that culminated in a beautiful slashing elbow that dropped Sonnen in the fourth round, then the finish.

Increased respect for Sonnen but pretending he didn't tap at first :no:

Silva did look like trash for much of the fight, he rarely attempted serious submissions, almost never scrambled, and had a loose lazy, guard that Sonnen passed easily. Almost no butterfly or spider guard and only-one body triangle from the bottom :no: BJJ no-nos when fighting a GnPer.

Sonnen is obviously the better wrestler, by far the most accomplished wrestler at middleweight besides Rosholt, Hendo, and Lindland, but I literally have never seen Silva fight that poorly. If the rib injury is legit, and I wouldn't expect Silva to lie after a win, then it explains it. He threw almost no kicks or knees, and an active guard puts a ton of torque on your torso.

Hell of a fight, hell of a card. I'm still ****ing amped from it.

[-playmaker-]

Hoooolyyyy shit what a night of fights, epic knockout comeback by Struve, Dos Santos did what we expected though props to Roy for hanging in there. The Guida fight was entertaining while it lasted and :applause: to Fitch for manhandling the larger, stronger Alves like that.

And hoooolyyyyy shit what a main event. Sonnen was the first fighter in a long time that wasn't scared of Anderson coming into the ring and it showed with that left cross that buckled Silva in the first. Silva literally won a minute of that fight, the standup barrage that culminated in a beautiful slashing elbow that dropped Sonnen in the fourth round, then the finish.

Increased respect for Sonnen but pretending he didn't tap at first :no:

Silva did look like trash for much of the fight, he rarely attempted serious submissions, almost never scrambled, and had a loose lazy, guard that Sonnen passed easily. Almost no butterfly or spider guard and only-one body triangle from the bottom :no: BJJ no-nos when fighting a GnPer.

Sonnen is obviously the better wrestler, by far the most accomplished wrestler at middleweight besides Rosholt, Hendo, and Lindland, but I literally have never seen Silva fight that poorly. If the rib injury is legit, and I wouldn't expect Silva to lie after a win, then it explains it. He threw almost no kicks or knees, and an active guard puts a ton of torque on your torso.

Hell of a fight, hell of a card. I'm still ****ing amped from it.
thank you...

you come off like a knowledgable MMA fan...and now I feel like I know what I saw was correct...

I wasn't even really aware of a rib injury...all I knew is that Anderson didn't look like Anderson...

[Pistol Pete]

I was saying the same thing then that I am now...Silva looked like he didn't give a f*ck...

that is just how it looked to me...and it is no excuse

maybe he trained like it was the fight of his life, but it sure didn't look that way to me...

Maybe it's the fact that Anderson Silva has always had weak takedown defense and for essentially his whole UFC career, he has been spoon fed punching bags who don't have the ability to attack his one area of weakness.

The only person Silva has ever fought with legitimate world class wrestling other than Chael Sonnen tonight is Dan Henderson. And in that fight, Anderson was taken down in the first round and controlled, he lost that round. Why was that fight different? Henderson stupidly relied on his iron jaw and his massive right hand and decided to strike with Anderson in round two, and for it, he got lit up with strikes and subsequently, choked out.

Anderson has fought other strikers (Franklin, Cote) and crushed them, he's fought BJJ black belts (Lutter, Maia, Leites) because people thought, if he can't be knocked out, maybe he can be subbed, but those guys all have horrible wrestling (granted, a gassed out Travis Lutter still took Anderson Silva down and mounted him) so they were never able to exploit their strength.

Chael Sonnen has the perfect makeup for fighting Silva, world class wrestling and most of all, he's intelligent enough to know that he can't strike with Anderson so he knows he has to take him down, and once he takes him down, like we saw tonight, Anderson will be controlled by anyone with legitimate top control. Unfortunately for Chael, he has one major weakness, his BJJ defense is weak - he's been subbed 11 times in his career and had this exact same scenario play out when he fought Paulo Filho for the WEC Middleweight Title, he crushed Filho for 4 rounds and then got subbed in the last round.

Anderson Silva took this fight seriously, but unlike his godly striking, he has very weak takedown defense, and when he's matched up with a guy who will stick to a gameplan like his life depends on it, he's in big trouble, because he cannot stop a takedown from a world class wrestler, and he can't escape a world class wrestlers top control. At that point, he has one option, either knock him out in the first 15-30 seconds of each round before he gets taken down, or submit him from the bottom like he's done to the only two people to control him (Travis Lutter and Chael Sonnen).

The thing this fight does is make Georges St. Pierre look like the guy who could take down Anderson Silva. Unlike Sonnen, St. Pierre has amazing BJJ defense from the top. St. Pierre also has superior striking to Sonnen and his wrestling is just as good as Sonnen's, if not better. St. Pierre may be the man to take down Silva once and for all, because like Sonnen, St. Pierre is very discplined and will follow a game plan to the letter. (Note: I am obviously a big St. Pierre fan, but Sonnen has shown the blueprint for beating Silva, and St. Pierre has all the skills to take advantage of it).

[-playmaker-]

Maybe it's the fact that Anderson Silva has always had weak takedown defense and for essentially his whole UFC career, he has been spoon fed punching bags who don't have the ability to attack his one area of weakness.

The only person Silva has ever fought with legitimate world class wrestling other than Chael Sonnen tonight is Dan Henderson. And in that fight, Anderson was taken down in the first round and controlled, he lost that round. Why was that fight different? Henderson stupidly relied on his iron jaw and his massive right hand and decided to strike with Anderson in round two, and for it, he got lit up with strikes and subsequently, choked out.

Anderson has fought other strikers (Franklin, Cote) and crushed them, he's fought BJJ black belts (Lutter, Maia, Leites) because people thought, if he can't be knocked out, maybe he can be subbed, but those guys all have horrible wrestling (granted, a gassed out Travis Lutter still took Anderson Silva down and mounted him) so they were never able to exploit their strength.

Chael Sonnen has the perfect makeup for fighting Silva, world class wrestling and most of all, he's intelligent enough to know that he can't strike with Anderson so he knows he has to take him down, and once he takes him down, like we saw tonight, Anderson will be controlled by anyone with legitimate top control. Unfortunately for Chael, he has one major weakness, his BJJ defense is weak - he's been subbed 11 times in his career and had this exact same scenario play out when he fought Paulo Filho for the WEC Middleweight Title, he crushed Filho for 4 rounds and then got subbed in the last round.

Anderson Silva took this fight seriously, but unlike his godly striking, he has very weak takedown defense, and when he's matched up with a guy who will stick to a gameplan like his life depends on it, he's in big trouble, because he cannot stop a takedown from a world class wrestler, and he can't escape a world class wrestlers top control. At that point, he has one option, either knock him out in the first 15-30 seconds of each round before he gets taken down, or submit him from the bottom like he's done to the only two people to control him (Travis Lutter and Chael Sonnen).

The thing this fight does is make Georges St. Pierre look like the guy who could take down Anderson Silva. Unlike Sonnen, St. Pierre has amazing BJJ defense from the top. St. Pierre also has superior striking to Sonnen and his wrestling is just as good as Sonnen's, if not better. St. Pierre may be the man to take down Silva once and for all, because like Sonnen, St. Pierre is very discplined and will follow a game plan to the letter. (Note: I am obviously a big St. Pierre fan, but Sonnen has shown the blueprint for beating Silva, and St. Pierre has all the skills to take advantage of it).
I just rewatched the Henderson fight, I really don't think it is fair to Silva to just determine that he has weak take down defense because of this one fight...

maybe he does...or maybe Silva just had weak defense TONIGHT...

neither one of knows how hard Silva trained or how seriously he took this fight...

If GSP and Silva somehow met at a weight I bet Silva would beat him...GSP just isn't as big...

I used to think Silva could beat Fedor if they allowed them to fight but I am not sure anymore...:oldlol:

[Pistol Pete]

I just rewatched the Henderson fight, I really don't think it is fair to Silva to just determine that he has weak take down defense because of this one fight...

maybe he does...or maybe Silva just had weak defense TONIGHT...

neither one of knows how hard Silva trained or how seriously he took this fight...

If GSP and Silva somehow met at a weight I bet Silva would beat him...GSP just isn't as big...

I used to think Silva could beat Fedor if they allowed them to fight but I am not sure anymore...:oldlol:

It's not one fight, go back and watch Travis Lutter vs Anderson Silva, Silva gets taken down repeatedly by Lutter with horrible, telegraphed shots. Quite simply, Anderson has weak takedown defense, the only reason it hasn't been exploited has been because he's been fighting BJJ black belts, and inferior strikers who have no interest in working from the top vs Anderson.

I mean, every man has his weakness, if you decide to strike with Anderson, you will get absolutely destroyed. His BJJ is very strong, which is natural given his Brazilian background. It's also very natural that his wrestling is the weakest aspect of his game, Brazilians typically have weaker wrestling (outside of like Ricardo Arona) since it's not apart of the culture like it is in the United States.

This was no fluke, if you wanted to put it in perspective, if we consider how elite Anderson is at striking, we can make a comparable analogy that Chael is as good as that with wrestling. If Sonnen wants to take Anderson down, he's going to take him down, especially since Anderson has weaker takedown defense. Wrestling has always been the dominant base for MMA (especially the UFC given it's scoring criteria), and tonight showed you why, dominant wrestling allows you to dictate where the fight goes and at what pace the fight moves. Sonnen crushed Silva but his weaker BJJ defense cost him the title.

[Zombles]

thank you...

you come off like a knowledgable MMA fan...and now I feel like I know what I saw was correct...

I wasn't even really aware of a rib injury...all I knew is that Anderson didn't look like Anderson...

yeah in the post-fight interview he said his ribs were jacked and his doctor advised him not to take the fight.

And Anderson's wrestling is by far the weakest part of his game, but he hit reversals on Marquardt and Henderson and was able to shrug off a lot of Sonnen's attempts in the fourth and fifth rounds. It's not as bad as it looked tonight

[-playmaker-]

It's not one fight, go back and watch Travis Lutter vs Anderson Silva, Silva gets taken down repeatedly by Lutter with horrible, telegraphed shots. Quite simply, Anderson has weak takedown defense, the only reason it hasn't been exploited has been because he's been fighting BJJ black belts, and inferior strikers who have no interest in working from the top vs Anderson.

I mean, every man has his weakness, if you decide to strike with Anderson, you will get absolutely destroyed. His BJJ is very strong, which is natural given his Brazilian background. It's also very natural that his wrestling is the weakest aspect of his game, Brazilians typically have weaker wrestling (outside of like Ricardo Arona) since it's not apart of the culture like it is in the United States.

This was no fluke, if you wanted to put it in perspective, if we consider how elite Anderson is at striking, we can make a comparable analogy that Chael is as good as that with wrestling. If Sonnen wants to take Anderson down, he's going to take him down, especially since Anderson has weaker takedown defense. Wrestling has always been the dominant base for MMA (especially the UFC given it's scoring criteria), and tonight showed you why, dominant wrestling allows you to dictate where the fight goes and at what pace the fight moves. Sonnen crushed Silva but his weaker BJJ defense cost him the title.
I don't think it was a fluke either but do you not at all think that maybe Silva could have made a stronger showing than he did here?

do you not even consider that maybe he just wasn't himself (for whatever reason) ???

he looked LIKE SHIT...I know damn well he could have prepared better for those take downs...Sonnen was just diving at him...it is what Sonnen does on the ground (wrestle) that makes him different, not the actual take down itself...

IDK, maybe you are right, but what I saw tonight looked like a Silva that just wasn't himslef...

[IcanzIIravor]

Sadly,yes.

Don't back down. It's all we have left at this point as Raider fans. :lol

[Pistol Pete]

I don't think it was a fluke either but do you not at all think that maybe Silva could have made a stronger showing than he did here?

do you not even consider that maybe he just wasn't himself (for whatever reason) ???

he looked LIKE SHIT...I know damn well he could have prepared better for those take downs...Sonnen was just diving at him...it is what Sonnen does on the ground (wrestle) that makes him different, not the actual take down itself...

IDK, maybe you are right, but what I saw tonight looked like a Silva that just wasn't himslef...

I mean, Silva could have done better, he could have landed a head kick in 10 seconds and the fight could have been over, but that didn't happen, just like Sonnen could have avoided the submission and been world champion, it's too difficult to deal with every hypothetical in this sport.

Silva has looked like a super human, but he's never been tested by a fighter like Sonnen, who has the absolute perfect makeup (World class wrestling, great cardio, great chin) to fight Silva. So as much as Silva looked poor, I think you have to attribute it to Sonnen making him look poor. And as poor as he looked, he still came away with the win when it looked like all hope was gone, which says amazing things about Anderson and his will to win and survive, it's the reason he is a great champion.

You sort of have it backwards, Sonnen is great because of those takedowns, but lacks the submission defense to truly be elite. His top control once he gets people down (ie. when he is on top on the ground) is also very strong, but the takedowns are one of his best assets, if he wants to take someone down, he has the technique, strength and athleticism to do it.

I'm not a Silva or Sonnen fan, but while Silva certainly looked bad, I think it was more Sonnen making him look bad then Silva having an off night. I think it's really down played how weak Silva's takedown defense has shown to be. If you follow a strict game plan, you can win, if you make mistakes, Anderson, being a great fighter, will likely capitilize and retain his title, as he did tonight.

Sonnen was perfect for 23 minutes, but he needed 25 and Silva took it away when Sonnen slipped up.

[Pistol Pete]

Now that I've made an argument from the Sonnen perspective, I will say that Anderson has said at his post fight and the press conference following the event that he had a rib injury, rumoured to be a broken rib. When you have a broken rib, you can barely breathe, you have trouble with movement, in general, everything hurts much more than it normally would.

The effect of a broken rib in this fight, first off, his striking defense was poor, he got hit with big punches from Sonnen standing which has never happened. A broken rib would effect his movement and timing on his feet so it could be legitimate. Additionally, as mentioned, he has swept guys in the past and reversed positions on the ground where as in this fight he was thoroughly controlled and really didn't offer much resistance on the ground outside of continuous movement and elbows from the bottom.

It's difficult, Sonnen obviously put on a career performance, so you want to give him credit, but Anderson has given so much reason to believe he would absolutely destroy Sonnen. If Anderson doesn't offer up the rib injury as a story, the credit would go 100% to Sonnen for making him look bad, but since he does, it leaves question marks.

Where do I think the truth lies? As always in these circumstances, somewhere in the middle. I think Sonnen has the skills and strength to take down a perfectly healthy Anderson Silva, I think he can land ground and pound and I think he can win rounds. But there is no denying the effect a possible broken rib would have on Silva's peformance tonight. I would attribute lots to Chael taking the fight to Anderson and exploiting his weaknesses, and then attribute the absolute one-sided nature of the fight to Anderson having a broken rib.

If they were to rematch, I'd still be taking Silva even if though I watched tonight. Anderson is a worldly talent, and I just would never bet against him... unless he was fighting Georges St. Pierre, of course.

[-playmaker-]

SOOOO....

Anderson has a f*ckin BROKEN RIB!!!


and some of you were acting like it was silly for me to say he didn't look the same...:lol


"oh, Silva was the same as ever, he just can't handle a wrestler, stop making excuses, blah blah blah"...





he HAD A BROKEN RIB!!!

even though Silva won, I would still like to see a rematch though, just to hush the doubters...

[Brujesino]

Iam starting to think who is like sonned but better and theres not any of them in the Middleweight division.

Imagine King Mo getting silva like that
http://www.b3ta.cr3ation.co.uk/data/gif/m0peice.gif

What about Rashad Evans?he might be able to beat him too.

Theres not much out there for silva in the middleweight division.He would have to go up to 205 but he already said he wont.

Vitor Belfort is up next then i would think Yushin Okami.I see him winning both.

[Zombles]

It was one of those taps, oh no I take it back moves. Why didnt Sonnen just let Silva break his f*cking arm and let the remaining time run out? Only like 30 seconds right? I would have let him break my shyt.

It was a triangle choke not an armbar, though the arm was isolated too. Most of the pressure was on the sides of Sonnen's neck cutting off the carotid arteries, blood flow to the brain, and there were two minutes left. He could have let himself go to sleep but if the carotids are shut down for two minutes Chael isn't getting a cast he's getting a casket.



could someone even tell me the last time Silva was taken down?....back like 5 years ago or some shit before his prime days?

Leites, Marquardt, Lutter, Henderson, and Franklin all took Silva down.

It's never been that hard to take the man down except lately, his guard on the ground is ferocious though. He destroys a GnPers base with his lanky ass legs pressing the thighs away or elevating the hips, or shuts down their torque by locking up a body triangle around the torso. He usually gets the fight stood-up when it hits the ground because his grappling defense is so good.

I'd bet just about anything the rib injury is legit. Silva's striking was amateurish, he was wading in there and swinging haymakers like he was Chris Leben, and his guard work looked pathetic for most of the fight.

I figure probably none of you train jiu-jitsu or muay thai but Silva's technique was horrible all fight, and this is a man who's forgotten more tech than I've ever learned.

A rematch would be a much easier win for a healthy Anderson. Sonnen is a spectacular wrestler; it isn't enough, but he deserves all the respect in the world for bringing it.

[Zombles]

http://www.ufc.com/media/117-silva-post-fight-interview

**** the haters that man is a great champion.

[KevinDurant4MVP]

LOL @ People claiming SOnnen dominated him for 4 rounds.


With 3 elbows to the head Silva did more damage then Sonnen did with his 100 weak punches.


Just look @ there faces @ the end of the fight. Sonnen was looking beyond terrible.


All sonnen did was just hold him o n the gorunds for 5 rounds. smh thats garbage mma

[-playmaker-]

http://www.ufc.com/media/117-silva-post-fight-interview

**** the haters that man is a great champion.
so he was actually out there fighting with broken ribs against doctor's orders...

:bowdown: Anderson


I KNEW something was wrong with him...

[Done_And_Done]

:applause: To his PR team


Facade or not, entering a fight on a PPV platform or any fight for that matter with a barely healed broken rib is an incredibly ballsy thing to do...

Respect Earned

[-playmaker-]

:applause: To his PR team


Facade or not, entering a fight on a PPV platform or any fight for that matter with a barely healed broken rib is an incredibly ballsy thing to do...

Respect Earned
I don't think he is lieing...

although I am sure it wasn't like a fresh break or anything, I have had a broken sternum and I couldn't even move my spice without going into deep pain...

but I don't take Silva as a liar...I believe him when he says his ribs are broken...

[sunsfan1357]

Didn't watch the fight, probably won't because I think I'll get mad at the fact that Sonnen got caught at the end and lost :oldlol:

I read somewhere the Sonnen outstruck Anderson 280+ - 29 or something crazy like that. As with all great champions, there is an instance when their back is against the ropes and they need to tough it out and get the W. Fedor has done it so many times, Brock did it against Carwin, etc. People may not approve of Anderson's actions in his past couple fights, but the man still finds ways to win and proves that he deserves to be champion.

[beasly15]

lol every round i kept saying " this is it, this is it ". silva got whooped the whole fight but then pulled it off. i was nervous the whole fight. i had 20 bucks on that shit!!! :oldlol:

[Real Men Wear Green]

It's a testament to Silva's greatness that wins like this one are analyzed the way that any other fighter's losses would be.

[Pharcyde]

Set up Silva vs. Yushin please.

[mattevans11]

I don't think he is lieing...

although I am sure it wasn't like a fresh break or anything, I have had a broken sternum and I couldn't even move my spice without going into deep pain...

but I don't take Silva as a liar...I believe him when he says his ribs are broken...

im not sure what side the rib was hurting.... but i recall sometime ( i want to say in the 3rd round) that sonnen straight up punched silva in the ribs like 3-4times. i was saying to myself " i cant believe that siva just took them like he did". I am not sure what side the broken ribs are on but I want to say that he took the punches to the left side very well.

before you say, the punches were weak...... a borken rib cant take a direct punch like that no matter what adult is throwing it.

[Poodle]

the rib excuse is BS. he looked fine to me. if anything sort of cocky and careless early, then after getting his ass kicked, he started trying a lot harder, and still couldn't stop the take downs, then ground and pound.

he couldn't have thrown some of those kicks if his rib were broken. even bruised ribs are extremely painful if something hits them, and it makes it hard to breathe. if anything he probably had slight bruised ribs or something but definitely not anything that looked like it really hindered him. you'd at least seen some wincing or pain on his face when he was moving his legs in guard, along with 3/4's of the time he was getting ground and pounded. a lot of that affects his rib area.

its a lame excuse. he could've caught Sonnen with some of those strikes and KO'd him, just like in a rematch, but all in all i'd take Sonnen if he comes into it as in shape as he did last night. 5 rounds as active as he was is amazing cardio. 90% of MMA fighters poop out in 3 rounds, and aren't throwing nearly as much as Sonnen did.

[-playmaker-]

what do you mean "it's a lame excuse"...HE WON!!!...Silva won the fight

Silva doesn't come off as the type to lie about something like this to me...

he also didn't look "fine" at all to me...not sure what you were watching but in the 5th Silva basiclly just layed down for Sonnen...


dude needs to release x-rays or something...lol

[Qwyjibo]

Even Sonnen said in the post-fight press conference that he expected more resistance from Silva and that if he was injured, it would make sense and he believed it. My respect for both guys went up. I went into this fight not liking either but their performances impressed me given the conditions.

Good overall card though. I was surprised by how much punishment Roy Nelson took and he even got a few shots in there. He was clearly outclassed in terms of talent and athleticism but managed to hang in there. I have a hard time seeing Dos Santos give either Brock or Cain too much trouble.

I was glad to see Guida win. He's nothing special but I didn't want to see him cut and 3 out of 4 losses would have put him close.

Fitch winning a decision was as predictable as the sun rising in the morning. Typical Fitch fight. Not the most entertaining but smart and efficient. Can't blame him for that.

[Brujesino]

Even Sonnen said in the post-fight press conference that he expected more resistance from Silva and that if he was injured, it would make sense and he believed it. My respect for both guys went up. I went into this fight not liking either but their performances impressed me given the conditions.

Good overall card though. I was surprised by how much punishment Roy Nelson took and he even got a few shots in there. He was clearly outclassed in terms of talent and athleticism but managed to hang in there. I have a hard time seeing Dos Santos give either Brock or Cain too much trouble.

I was glad to see Guida win. He's nothing special but I didn't want to see him cut and 3 out of 4 losses would have put him close.

Fitch winning a decision was as predictable as the sun rising in the morning. Typical Fitch fight. Not the most entertaining but smart and efficient. Can't blame him for that.
He also said that if the commission sanctioned it and dana white wasnt there he would fight him right there.:oldlol:

[-playmaker-]

if that shit talker admitts that Silva didn't put up much defense then you know something is wrong...

[Jackass18]

That has to suck royal donkey dick for Chael. 2 minutes away from taking the belt from the best fighter on the planet? Ouch. Maybe you should have tried to end the fight instead of grinding out the last 3 rounds, sucker. I'll take Silva in a rematch. Sonnen basically fought perfectly for 4 and a half rounds and still lost. It just seems to me that Sonnen would have to win by decision, so he would have to fight very, very well for 5 rounds and make very few mistakes which is quite difficult to do.

Fightmetric had it Sonnen 320 landed strikes to Silva's 64.

[Jackass18]

Now, about the other fights.

JDS gave Nelson a beating, but Nelson was able to take it. I'm not sure this bodes well for JDS against Lesnar.

I still dislike Hughes, but I have to give him props for that win, though I was never really high on Almeida. What has he done since his return other than beat bums and TUF scrubs? I'm not impressed with wins over Horwich, Glass Jaw Grove and Matt "The Mediocre" Brown.

The Guida fight was a bit odd, it ended kind of like the Overeem/Arona fight (1 guy tapped in a position that you wouldn't normally see a guy tap in, but then later you find out he got injured earlier in the fight).

I'm really starting to like watching Struve fight. I thought there was no way in hell he was going to comeback from the beating he took in round 1, but a 1 round beating doesn't stop a tall, lanky bastid like him.

I'm glad Alves lost. You miss weight, then I can't root for you, unless it's something like Alves/Hughes...