What do ppl expect from lebron, honestly?

[rfm767]

He is a phenomenal player, all around impact, but he's not your classic hero ball iso superstar (jordan/kobe etc.). Why do people here pretend he fails or wins every game based solely on him scoring 40 pts and 20 of those in the 4th?

Its just not the type of player lebron is, we've seen him 10 years and his playing style has always been the same, you guys should know by now.

[Inferno]

To become a leader in the 4th.

[bluechox2]

the show why he was mvp, not a statpadder

[Collie]

But he CAN do that. That's why it's so frustrating when he plays passive when the team needs him to score.

[9erempiree]

Smartest thing someone has said. I believe Lebron has hit his ceiling. It is what it is.

He's not the Kobe and MJ type.

[PickernRoller]

To become a leader in the 4th.

where most games are decided i might add....in the playoffs of course. Do or die - defense picks up, intensity picks up....everything is on the line.

Big third quarter leads do help your case but lets be real, the 4th is the 4th.

[Inferno]

where most games are decided i might add....in the playoffs of course.

Yeah. :cheers:


He's an interesting case. Sometimes he takes over in the fourth, but sometimes he chokes it away.

[jzek]

He could have easily scored 20 in the 4th but for some reason he decided the team would be better off if he kept passing the ball. And no, SA's defense had nothing to do with it... let's face it - no one on this planet can stop LeBron if he decides he will attack the basket and try to score.

[cotdt]

He did play good defense on Parker in the 4th.

[nathanjizzle]

exactly, people act like hes a legend because he has 1 championship. he is barely a legend he has more memorable 4th quarters of him choking than taking over.

[hkfosho]

To become a leader in the 4th.

I guess some players aren't mentally capable of pulling through in the most pressurized situations. Give lebron some slack guys, he's still a great player (check out his triple-double!)

[Screamingdoom]

I expect him to score 25 to 30 points. That shouldn't be too much to ask.

[Jacks3]

Nobody is saying he has to come down and shoot every time he touches the ball. They're just asking for more assertiveness and aggressiveness. 18 pts is unacceptable for a guy who is supposed to be GOAT caliber.

[PickernRoller]

But he CAN do that. That's why it's so frustrating when he plays passive when the team needs him to score.

Depends on the front court of the team. His jumper ain't gold.

[#number6ix#]

I agree with op post he plays the same way... The same pass he'll make in the 1st quarter he'll make in the 4th quarter if its the right play but sometimes he should force the issue trust his jumper and takeover

[Kingwillball]

A more aggressive approach.

[bagelred]

We expect him to lose. He'll never be Tim Duncan. Overrated.

[Jackass18]

It's simple, he has to do everything or he's a failure.

[Le Shaqtus]

The Number 1 option on your team should not have 18 points... In a finals game. What was he thinking?

Hopefully he'll come back in game 2 and have a better scoring mindset.

[rfm767]

Nobody is saying he has to come down and shoot every time he touches the ball. They're just asking for more assertiveness and aggressiveness. 18 pts is unacceptable for a guy who is supposed to be GOAT caliber.


Spurs would run circles around Miami if they were to present a one-superstar oriented kind of game, name it lebron, wade, bosh or whoever. Miami needs to play this same ball to stand a chance. Spurs are a monster team with a monster coach right where they feel comfortable, The Finals. Its scary because I think Spurs played below their average, moreso than miami.

[PickernRoller]

Yeah. :cheers:


He's an interesting case. Sometimes he takes over in the fourth, but sometimes he chokes it away.

I want LeMarcus in a Lakers jersey. For some reason Mitch ain't high about him :cry:

[iDunkOnFatKids]

I expect him to takeover in clutch time and will his team to victory. He is a 4-time mvp, and the best player on the planet, I think that is a reasonable expectation, no?

[AintNoSunshine]

I expect him to utilize his improved jumper when the spurs are shutting down all lanes to drive, and not become useless when he can't get to the basket because he has absolutely no confidence in his shot.

Scoring wise he's exactly the same as in 2007:facepalm 50 times better

[Collie]

The thing with Lebron is that he stops shooting when he feels that his jumper isn't going down. That's when he'll go to passive mode, unlike Kobe and MJ who would keep firing. It's just how he's wired.

[jrong]

He could have easily scored 20 in the 4th but for some reason he decided the team would be better off if he kept passing the ball. And no, SA's defense had nothing to do with it... let's face it - no one on this planet can stop LeBron if he decides he will attack the basket and try to score.

He was 7/16. The Spurs stopped him 9 out of 16 times. They had a great defensive gameplan against him.

The Spurs are an awesome team. This is not the OKC Finals Virgins.

If LeBron could have scored 20 in the 4th (or in the game), then he would have. He didn't have it tonight. He gets another chance Sunday.

[LeBird]

People basically expect him to always win.

18 points 18 rebounds and 10 assists. He was the #1 offensive player in the game as well as the #1 defensive player.

People are so ingrained with the MJ/Kobe way of playing that the only way you get a pass for losing is if you score 30+ - regardless of how you're shooting, the playmaking of others or any other facet.

[miller-time]

Smartest thing someone has said. I believe Lebron has hit his ceiling. It is what it is.

He's not the Kobe and MJ type.

I've said this before (possibley to you) but there is more than one way to play basketball! Duncan, Bird, Magic, Wilt, Shaq were not Kobe and MJ types, but they all got the job done in their own way. The next level for LeBron is not to become MJ. It would just be an even more impactful LeBron.

[shortsoptional]

People saying the same thing about LeBron as they did in 2011 because he seems passive. What people don't realize is that Carlisle (and Pop) kept James from driving and making him either shoot jumpers or pass.

LeBron is still going to make plays and he's going to score throughout the game in transition, but at the end of the day, LeBron will make the correct basketball play and won't try to take over games because he can't always do that from a SCORING standpoint. He'll score, and he'll play very well, but when he HAS TO SCORE, he can't will that to happen.

[Ne 1]

Smartest thing someone has said. I believe Lebron has hit his ceiling. It is what it is.

He's not the Kobe and MJ type.

Yeah, sometimes jack of all trades, master of none types don't always get the job done. Because they have no specialty. Guys like Jordan, Kobe, Bird, and even prime Wade ... they did everything well, have great all around games. But they could still go flip a switch and be the absolute best player on the floor at a certain aspect of the game IE scoring.

Thus kind of a glimpse into LeBron's 2010 and 2011 failures. He had a very limited offensive game. It was always either transition dunk, or jacking a three off the dribble.

In 2012, he improved his footwork, his post game, his aggressive mentality and added a pinch post reliable post game ... and he finally started to develop a consistent mid range-ish scoring game. And BAM ... finally wins his first ring.

[cotdt]

We expect him to fail.

[KG215]

Nobody is saying he has to come down and shoot every time he touches the ball. They're just asking for more assertiveness and aggressiveness. 18 pts is unacceptable for a guy who is supposed to be GOAT caliber.
Pretty much this. The 18 rebounds and 10 assists are great, and the 18-18-10 stat line looks great; but if you're supposed to be peak Jordan good, or GOAT good, you've got to be more aggressive scoring the ball. Anything less than 20 points is unacceptable at this stage unless it's a blowout.

[Jacks3]

Spurs would run circles around Miami if they were to present a one-superstar oriented kind of game, name it lebron, wade, bosh or whoever. Miami needs to play this same ball to stand a chance. Spurs are a monster team with a monster coach right where they feel comfortable, The Finals. Its scary because I think Spurs played below their average, moreso than miami.
This doesn't make any sense. LeBron being more aggressive doesn't mean Miami can't still play great "team" ball. You can have both these things simultaneously.


LeBron makes things A LOT easier for the Spurs when he goes into these passive modes.

However, I do except him to much more aggressive in Game 2 and the rest of the series.

And you're right about the Spurs not playing that well. They missed A TON of wide-open threes.

[returnofthemack]

He could have easily scored 20 in the 4th but for some reason he decided the team would be better off if he kept passing the ball. And no, SA's defense had nothing to do with it... let's face it - no one on this planet can stop LeBron if he decides he will attack the basket and try to score.

if lebron cuts to the basket he is unstoppable. he will either get the foul or the basket 80% of the time. when he was in cleveland i could never understand why he wouldnt just go to the hole when they needed a bucket. it sucked when he was on the cavs but its sweet when hes on the heat. go spurs

[LeBird]

People are so ingrained with the MJ/Kobe way of playing that the only way you get a pass for losing is if you score 30+ - regardless of how you're shooting, the playmaking of others or any other facet.

Exhibit A:


Pretty much this. The 18 rebounds and 10 assists are great, and the 18-18-10 stat line looks great; but if you're supposed to be peak Jordan good, or GOAT good, you've got to be more aggressive scoring the ball. Anything less than 20 points is unacceptable at this stage unless it's a blowout.

[razzredazzre]

I expect him to choke nothing surprising to me

[shortsoptional]

Yeah, sometimes jack of all trades, master of none types don't always get the job done. Because they have no specialty. Guys like Jordan, Kobe, Bird, and even prime Wade ... they did everything well, have great all around games. But they could still go flip a switch and be the absolute best player on the floor at a certain aspect of the game IE scoring.

Thus kind of a glimpse into LeBron's 2010 and 2011 failures. He had a very limited offensive game. It was always either transition dunk, or jacking a three off the dribble.



THIS... smart coaches (Pop, Carlisle.. ect) will keep James out of the lane and play on the perimeter. He might hit some jumpers, but it's not his strength.

I get irritated when people say LeBron choked in 2011 (and people are saying it about him tonight)... NO...they have made James beat them from the outside and it's just not his game. Doesn't mean he's a bad player... it's just making him beat you with the lesser part of his game.

[Le Shaqtus]

Exhibit A:

Ok, you don't expect him to score 30+ a game, what do you want?

He was a playmaker, he only scored 18 points in a triple double and they lost. What do you expect?

[Genaro]

Well if you want to talk about Lebron on the same breath of likes of Jordan, Bird, Magic or Kobe he got to dominate the game in the closing minutes.
People during all year in this same forum talk about Lebron being GOAT material. So the expectations is to him to perform as GOAT.

[bluechox2]

take over, instead of bitching around making heros, be the hero

[KG215]

This doesn't make any sense. LeBron being more aggressive doesn't mean Miami can't still play great "team" ball. You can have both these things simultaneously.


LeBron makes things A LOT easier for the Spurs when he goes into these passive modes.

However, I do except him to much more aggressive in Game 2 and the rest of the series.

And you're right about the Spurs not playing that well. They missed A TON of wide-open threes.
There was a stretch late in the 3rd and early in the 4th where they missed at least 5 or 6 wide-open 3's; and most of them were corner 3's. They might have a similar game in Miami again, but they won't miss that many open 3's at home.

[DMAVS41]

He is a phenomenal player, all around impact, but he's not your classic hero ball iso superstar (jordan/kobe etc.). Why do people here pretend he fails or wins every game based solely on him scoring 40 pts and 20 of those in the 4th?

Its just not the type of player lebron is, we've seen him 10 years and his playing style has always been the same, you guys should know by now.

Yea, but a guy like Magic could control a game without scoring. Lebron does this a lot as well, but he didn't do it tonight.

It's not like Lebron played poorly or something...he was very good...maybe the best player in the game. But that isn't going to cut it.

He has to be by far the best player in this series if the Heat want to win. And honestly, that shouldn't be a struggle if he's as good as his fans/he say/think he is.

This is a prime Lebron James. A guy that people are talking about as perhaps one of the 5 best players ever. If he can't be the clear cut best player in this series...well, then it's another knock against him in my opinion.

[Jacks3]

There was a stretch late in the 3rd and early in the 4th where they missed at least 5 or 6 wide-open 3's; and most of them were corner 3's. They might have a similar game in Miami again, but they won't miss that many open 3's at home.
Exactly. Heat are in trouble.

[rfm767]

This doesn't make any sense. LeBron being more aggressive doesn't mean Miami can't still play great "team" ball. You can have both these things simultaneously.


LeBron makes things A LOT easier for the Spurs when he goes into these passive modes.

However, I do except him to much more aggressive in Game 2 and the rest of the series.

And you're right about the Spurs not playing that well. They missed A TON of wide-open threes.

Yes, you're right, lebron needs perhaps a bit more aggressiveness. Bolded was really incredible, hard to believe they pulled of with that perimeter game.

[The Iron Fist]

He is a phenomenal player, all around impact, but he's not your classic hero ball iso superstar (jordan/kobe etc.). Why do people here pretend he fails or wins every game based solely on him scoring 40 pts and 20 of those in the 4th?

Its just not the type of player lebron is, we've seen him 10 years and his playing style has always been the same, you guys should know by now.
Chosen One
Witness
Check My Stats


maybe?

[pauk]

Anything less than ~30-10-10 is a failure for Lebron.... ~20-20-10 is worse

[Ca$H]

dominate the last five minutes.

[nathanjizzle]

Anything less than ~30-10-10 is a failure for Lebron.... ~20-20-10 is worse

he grabbed a bunch of def rebounds that were going to be grabed by the heat anyway, he passed to players that had to score for him, he scored less than 4 points in the 4th. deal it

[pauk]

Yes, you're right, lebron needs perhaps a bit more aggressiveness. Bolded was really incredible, hard to believe they pulled of with that perimeter game.

Aggressiveness? He was allover the god damn court......... you are talking about chucking/shotjacking type of aggressiveness, admit it?

Its funny how so many fans want Lebron to shotjack a la Kobe or something, he aint that kindof player and never was his entire god damn life... you really think they would have won if Lebron was selfish? He created MUCH better shots for his teammates than he could have done by himself/for himself in especially the clutch tonight........ he drove in to multiple traps inside and then hit Bosh with a WIIIIIIDEOPEN 3pt shot which he bricks........ then hits Wade with a WIIIDEOPEN layup which he bricks.... both baskets could have tied/won the game............ what the hell do you want?

[Boomerang]

Aggressiveness? He was allover the god damn court......... you are talking about chucking/shotjacking type of aggressiveness, admit it?

Its funny how so many fans want Lebron to shotjack a la Kobe or something, he aint that kindof player.... you really think they would have won if Lebron was selfish? He created MUCH better shots for his teammates than he could have done by himself/for himself in especially the clutch tonight........ hits Bosh with a WIIIIIIDEOPEN 3pt shot which he bricks........ hits Wade with a WIIIDEOPEN layup which he bricks.... both baskets could have tied/won the game............ what the hell do you want?
:oldlol:

[DMAVS41]

Anything less than ~30-10-10 is a failure for Lebron.... ~20-20-10 is worse

Impact and stats aren't always the same thing.

Here is the problem...Lebron didn't do anything to force the Spurs out of their game plan.

And it's of course not all on him...coaching and help comes into play as well...but Lebron didn't dominate the game. And unfortunately he's going to need to in some capacity to win the title this year.

His help is easily the worst it's been in the big 3 era...this is by far the worst Heat team with the way Wade and Bosh are playing currently.

And so he either needs to dominate the game...or take over down the stretch. Tonight he did neither and they lost.

It's not easy...very few guys in the history of the game have been able to do it...especially from the perimeter.

[rfm767]

Aggressiveness? He was allover the god damn court......... you are talking about chucking/shotjacking type of aggressiveness, admit it?

Its funny how so many fans want Lebron to shotjack a la Kobe or something, he aint that kindof player and never was his entire god damn life... you really think they would have won if Lebron was selfish? He created MUCH better shots for his teammates than he could have done by himself/for himself in especially the clutch tonight........ he drove in to multiple traps inside and then hit Bosh with a WIIIIIIDEOPEN 3pt shot which he bricks........ then hits Wade with a WIIIDEOPEN layup which he bricks.... both baskets could have tied/won the game............ what the hell do you want?

I think you've got the wrong person buddy.

[nathanjizzle]

Aggressiveness? He was allover the god damn court......... you are talking about chucking/shotjacking type of aggressiveness, admit it?

Its funny how so many fans want Lebron to shotjack a la Kobe or something, he aint that kindof player and never was his entire god damn life... you really think they would have won if Lebron was selfish? He created MUCH better shots for his teammates than he could have done by himself/for himself in especially the clutch tonight........ he drove in to multiple traps inside and then hit Bosh with a WIIIIIIDEOPEN 3pt shot which he bricks........ then hits Wade with a WIIIDEOPEN layup which he bricks.... both baskets could have tied/won the game............ what the hell do you want?

:roll:

[PJR]

Score. Engage the ball. Be aggressive. Trying to play like to be Jason Kidd/Rondo in a f*cking NBA Finals game? The sh*t doesn't work. He played right in the Spurs hands.


When the going got tough late, Tony Parker demanded the ball and forced the issue, hitting a couple of shots after working hard to free himself to get those shots off.

When the going got tough for Miami, LeBron held the ball for 4/5 seconds, and deferred. He left guys like Rio or Ray Allen in no mans land late in the shot clock. Wasted possessions. Also had an crucial turnover late trying to force feed Wade in the post. Once again, instead of looking for his shot.

That was not good enough for a 4 time MVP. That was 2011 Finals-esque. I'm hopeful he redeems himself.

[Ca$H]

Aggressiveness? He was allover the god damn court......... you are talking about chucking/shotjacking type of aggressiveness, admit it?

Its funny how so many fans want Lebron to shotjack a la Kobe or something, he aint that kindof player and never was his entire god damn life... you really think they would have won if Lebron was selfish? He created MUCH better shots for his teammates than he could have done by himself/for himself in especially the clutch tonight........ he drove in to multiple traps inside and then hit Bosh with a WIIIIIIDEOPEN 3pt shot which he bricks........ then hits Wade with a WIIIDEOPEN layup which he bricks.... both baskets could have tied/won the game............ what the hell do you want?

People love shotjacking/ hero ball because of Jordan and Kobe. It is what it is.

[pauk]

Impact and stats aren't always the same thing.

Here is the problem...Lebron didn't do anything to force the Spurs out of their game plan.

Really? So they wanted Lebron to hit wideopen players all night long? They wanted Lebron to give that wideopen 3pt shot to Bosh in the clutch and that layup to Wade at the end?

They wanted that? Really? My god.... perfect gameplan..... considering they knew those guys would choke/brick those shots after Lebron has been MURDERING teams the entire year this way...........

[Skip Bayless]

LeBron flat out choked tonight.

[I.R.Beast]

people will look at the boxscore and say he had 10 assists and 18 rebounds.... eff that. We dont care bout your rebounding total, let your hustle guys do that dirty work. We care about you dominating the most important end of the floor OFFENSE....scoring is still the most important in basketball. What stand out to me is 7-16 and him deferring excessively in the forth with the spurs shifting momentum in their favor. His triple double was as empty as can be because he wasnt the best player on the floor when the team needed it. parker called his number for SA down the stretch and began to attack. james was supposed to do more of the same. He was too bust nursing a a gaudy statline than being the man in the clutch. he got lots of help tonight he should have been the won reeling that win in.

[DMAVS41]

Really? So they wanted Lebron to hit wideopen players all night long? They wanted Lebron to give that wideopen 3pt shot to Bosh in the clutch and that layup to Wade at the end?

They wanted that? Really? My god.... perfect gameplan.....

Yes. Are you kidding me? Do you want aggressive Lebron taking over or Bosh taking threes with the game on the line?

Are you serious? You take the Bosh shots all day long.

Lebron needs to get his ass in the post and score until they hard double. If he can't do that...it could be trouble for the Heat.

And it's about more than the entire game. You certainly want that late in games. Close games are just inevitable in the playoffs...especially in the finals. And the Spurs absolutely want Chalmers and Bosh taking long jumpers instead of Lebron shooting or attacking. What the **** are you talking about?

And when will you get it? The Heat aren't as good as they were the whole year. Bosh has just been dreadful all playoffs...and Wade looked a bit better tonight like he did in game 7, but he's still way off where he was when the Heat were great this season.

It's not going to be easy, but playing that style won't win unless the Heat role players and Bosh/Wade start magically playing much better than they have all playoffs.

[chazzy]

Lebron needs to be the 30pt threat he was last series and last year in the playoffs. Wasn't aggressive enough as a scorer in the 2nd half at all until it was too late, and that played right into what the Spurs wanted. Go ahead and take those 3s, Bosh :oldlol:

[DMAVS41]

Lebron needs to be the 30pt threat he was last series and last year in the playoffs. Wasn't aggressive enough as a scorer in the 2nd half at all until it was too late, and that played right into what the Spurs wanted. Go ahead and take those 3s, Bosh :oldlol:

Exactly.

That team ball style works great when you have the team to do it. The current Heat simply aren't that. Wade is 60 percent as good as he was during the streak and Bosh has just become a joke. Battier can't even get playing time...and until this game...Allen had been broke for a while

And it plays right into Pop's hands and he'll gladly make Cole, Allen, Bosh, Miller, and Wade beat them from the outside 4 out of 6 games now.

[coin24]

This is my problem. Idiots on here comparing him to Jordan, then they claim but the spurs adjusted there D and Lebron couldn't play his style of game:cry:
No shit, it's the finals. He's supposed to step up, not play like a passive pus5y..

You think MJ turned into a bitch when they double or even triple teamed him? No, he found ways to win, that is the difference.
Lebron is a beta, soft and weak mentally individual. You cant expect anything else from him..

[SamuraiSWISH]

If you're getting hyped up as being better than Money, I expect a LOT more.

[DMAVS41]

If you're getting hyped up as being better than Money, I expect a LOT more.

Yea. I think Lebron fans are missing this. It's not like anyone is saying Lebron sucked tonight...at least I'm not. He played well...hell, might have been the best player on the floor.

But his competition is prime Magic, MJ, Bird, Hakeem, Duncan..etc.

All of those guys in their prime would rape teams putting out current Parker and old Duncan.

And Lebron has no mulligans left. He used them all up in 2010 and 2011...not to mention 2007 finals...although that really wasn't that big of a deal.

So Lebron doesn't have the luxury of not being all time great anymore. And rightfully so. You want to go down as top 5 all time? Better not lose a series to the current Spurs...and if you do lose...you better go down with all time epic games.

[DMV2]

LeBon's assists are so fcking overrated that it's ashame people look at his triple doubles as something monumental. 18 boards was impressive, though you gotta consider that he plays with a jump shooting PF who's nowhere near the paint 90% of the time so of course he'll get a lot of rebounds.

But back to his assists. He's gonna get credit for a lot of assists. Why? Because his teams never play with real ball movement. It's always him with the ball for 15-20 seconds, then he's passing to his teammates to shoots it. They make it, he gets an assist. If not that then his assists come from transitional plays.

Now look at Parker. He gets 5 o 6 assists. That looks awful for an elite starting point guard but then you realized his team has great ball movement that his teammates like Duncan or Manu can get 4 to 5 assists each on any given night. Some of those assists could go to Parker if he was just as ball dominant as LeBron.

[FLDFSU]

Yea, but a guy like Magic could control a game without scoring. Lebron does this a lot as well, but he didn't do it tonight.

It's not like Lebron played poorly or something...he was very good...maybe the best player in the game. But that isn't going to cut it.

He has to be by far the best player in this series if the Heat want to win. And honestly, that shouldn't be a struggle if he's as good as his fans/he say/think he is.

This is a prime Lebron James. A guy that people are talking about as perhaps one of the 5 best players ever. If he can't be the clear cut best player in this series...well, then it's another knock against him in my opinion.

I get a kick out of all your posts. Everything you ever posts contradicts your point about the Heat having a stacked team (relative to competition).

The most stacked team in NBA History shouldn't need Lebron "to be by far the best player in the series if the Heat want to win."

Isn't that the point of having a stacked team?

[lefthook00]

He needs to learn that sometimes a 40/5/2 game is better than a 18/18/10 triple double.

LeBron seemed super calm during the post game conference though, I'm sure he'll adjust.

[DMAVS41]

I get a kick out of all your posts. Everything you ever posts contradicts your point about the Heat having a stacked team (relative to competition).

The most stacked team in NBA History shouldn't need Lebron "to be by far the best player in the series if the Heat want to win."

Isn't that the point of having a stacked team?

If you can't understand what having a stacked team means....why should I keep explaining it to you?

First off...I never said the Heat were the most stacked team ever relative to their competition. Unless it was about the first 2 rounds...which honestly...they might have been.

The Heat are stacked....but they aren't playing well right now. You know you have a stacked team when the margin for error is this big. They haven't played well all playoffs and they are in the finals...didn't play well again tonight and they almost won again.

It's not a retroactive thing.

Obviously they are not playing well right now and Lebron has to do more. Until you realize that you can have both....please stop posting. Getting very annoying.

[FLDFSU]

Exactly.

That team ball style works great when you have the team to do it. The current Heat simply aren't that. Wade is 60 percent as good as he was during the streak and Bosh has just become a joke. Battier can't even get playing time...and until this game...Allen had been broke for a while

And it plays right into Pop's hands and he'll gladly make Cole, Allen, Bosh, Miller, and Wade beat them from the outside 4 out of 6 games now.


Oh never mind, I see you changed your opinion of the whole the Heat is super stacked thing.

[DMAVS41]

Oh never mind, I see you changed your opinion of the whole the Heat is super stacked thing.

You don't retroactively call a team not stacked. They aren't playing well right now and are still in the finals and may very well win a title not playing well.

Like I have repeatedly said...it speaks to the greatness of Lebron and the fact that the Heat are stacked relative to the competition.

They played significantly worse all playoffs than they did in the regular season and they still made the finals. that is what being stacked means.

Not many teams have the luxury of playing like ass and still making the finals.

Part because of Lebron's greatness...part because they are stacked relative to competition.

Not sure what you are going off about...the 11 Heat were stacked. The 12 Heat and Thunder were stacked. The 08 through 10 Lakers were stacked. The 08 and 10 Celtics were stacked....etc..etc...etc.

When you have arguably the best player paired with the best or one of the best supporting casts...you are stacked.

Doesn't mean they can't play poorly...please get that through your head.

[I.R.Beast]

LeBon's assists are so fcking overrated that it's ashame people look at his triple doubles as something monumental. 18 boards was impressive, though you gotta consider that he plays with a jump shooting PF who's nowhere near the paint 90% of the time so of course he'll get a lot of rebounds.

But back to his assists. He's gonna get credit for a lot of assists. Why? Because his teams never play with real ball movement. It's always him with the ball for 15-20 seconds, then he's passing to his teammates to shoots it. They make it, he gets an assist. If not that then his assists come from transitional plays.

Now look at Parker. He gets 5 o 6 assists. That looks awful for an elite starting point guard but then you realized his team has great ball movement that his teammates like Duncan or Manu can get 4 to 5 assists each on any given night. Some of those assists could go to Parker if he was just as ball dominant as LeBron.
yep...his assist numbers are very inflated

[I.R.Beast]

You don't retroactively call a team not stacked. They aren't playing well right now and are still in the finals and may very well win a title not playing well.

Like I have repeatedly said...it speaks to the greatness of Lebron and the fact that the Heat are stacked relative to the competition.

They played significantly worse all playoffs than they did in the regular season and they still made the finals. that is what being stacked means.

Not many teams have the luxury of playing like ass and still making the finals.

Part because of Lebron's greatness...part because they are stacked relative to competition.

Not sure what you are going off about...the 11 Heat were stacked. The 12 Heat and Thunder were stacked. The 08 through 10 Lakers were stacked. The 08 and 10 Celtics were stacked....etc..etc...etc.

When you have arguably the best player paired with the best or one of the best supporting casts...you are stacked.

Doesn't mean they can't play poorly...please get that through your head.
kobe Pau and role players isnt my idea of stacked

[Clifton]

Lebron is right not to listen to guys who say that he should force up shots and "dominate" scoring the ball. Lebron's best attribute has always been his ballhandling and passing.

That said, while he can be the best on the planet, top 5 all time great, etc., as he is now, he can't be the GOAT unless his eyes start lighting up in those rare moments when he has to be the one scoring. There are fewer moments like that than most people think, but there are some, and when it comes down to it, Lebron doesn't know what to do in those moments, unless he's on fire, or there's an open lane to the basket. He scores according to what the defense gives him, not according to what he takes from it.

He needs to perfect his high- and low-post game. I don't think a jumper is the answer; he doesn't seem to have the talent for jumpshooting that Durant and company do. It's gotta be footwork that puts him over the top, and insisting on the move, like Paul Pierce does. If Bron just got an injection of Paul Pierce, he'd be the greatest ever. He's just not quite there.

[SamuraiSWISH]

LeBon's assists are so fcking overrated that it's ashame people look at his triple doubles as something monumental.
FINALLY someone says it ... was thinking the same thing all night, at least in regards to this game.

Half his assists came not on impressive looks, but excellent shots with at times defenders all over theme (see Ray Allen)

Totally padded.


18 boards was impressive, though you gotta consider that he plays with a jump shooting PF who's nowhere near the paint 90% of the time so of course he'll get a lot of rebounds.
Agreed.


Yea. I think Lebron fans are missing this. It's not like anyone is saying Lebron sucked tonight...at least I'm not. He played well...hell, might have been the best player on the floor.

But his competition is prime Magic, MJ, Bird, Hakeem, Duncan..etc.

All of those guys in their prime would rape teams putting out current Parker and old Duncan.

And Lebron has no mulligans left. He used them all up in 2010 and 2011...not to mention 2007 finals...although that really wasn't that big of a deal.

So Lebron doesn't have the luxury of not being all time great anymore. And rightfully so. You want to go down as top 5 all time? Better not lose a series to the current Spurs...and if you do lose...you better go down with all time epic games.
Co-sign.

[Poetry]

FINALLY someone says it ... was thinking the same thing all night, at least in regards to this game.

I wonder what his passing would be like in a league that didn't have a three-point line.

[Simple Jack]

Everything about LeBron is exaggerated. He holds the ball 18-20 seconds and makes a pass to a player who's triple teamed who throws up a desperation shot to give him an assist? That's how LeBron facilitates? **** outta here.

Dude's throwing cross court passes after drawing defensive attention on the regular. You don't have like 4-5 guys shooting an absurdly high % from 3 because they shoot desperation shots at the end of the shot clock because Bron was ball hogging.

[LeBird]

Ok, you don't expect him to score 30+ a game, what do you want?

He was a playmaker, he only scored 18 points in a triple double and they lost. What do you expect?

His assists affected 2-point and 3-point plays. If you want to look at his actual contribution you have to consider that as well as the points he himself scores. That is a contribution of 40+ points on offense. People criticising him should instead be criticising his teammates and his coach. They're the ones with enough resources to win this thing. If they don't it won't be on him if he continues playing this way.

But as I said, unfortunately, unless you're jacking up shots, scoring 30+ points, regardless of anything else, you'll be seen as having a bad game if you're Lebron.