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Schrempf Scampi
Hakeem vs Kareem
Been having a lot of these discussions off the internet lately and would like to hear some arguments for both sides.
Who would you take and why?
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happy tanksgiving
Re: Hakeem vs Kareem
Kareem clearly had the better career. But I'd take prime dream over prime jabar, mainly because he's a better defensive anchor.
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Luchini from the sky
Re: Hakeem vs Kareem
Kareem for me... sky hook is one of the surest shots in basketball history. Though Hakeem dominated him in the 86 WCF he was already 39 by then.
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Schrempf Scampi
Re: Hakeem vs Kareem
Waiting on Fatal/Shaqattack/Jlauber/Kblaze
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Re: Hakeem vs Kareem
Kareem just because he's a few inches taller than the Dream.
Shaq would've been the best center ever but he sucks at free throws.
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Luchini from the sky
Re: Hakeem vs Kareem
Originally Posted by Simple Jack
Waiting on Fatal/Shaqattack/Jlauber/Kblaze
Shaqattack will say Shaq is greater than either of them, while lauber will say Chamberlain > Shaq. 5 pages of arguments will happen between each other, then KBlaze will chime in and write a thesis about how we can't conclusively prove that each center is better, lamenting on the state of the forum and how its gone down from the early 2000s.
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Re: Hakeem vs Kareem
Head to head numbers
Old man no rebounding Kareem in the twilight of his career played Hakeem very well. First played against him when he was 37. Prime Kareem would wreck him. Huge size difference, similar mobility, just a really bad matchup for Hakeem -- he's more PF sized than C.
It's crazy how good Kareem was for so long. Duncan and KG are basically roleplayers at 33/34, KG with the awesome defense but still.
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ThaSwagg3r
Fan in the Stands (unregistered)
Re: Hakeem vs Kareem
Kareem was better than Hakeem at literally every aspect of the game besides defense. One of the few players that has a legitimate argument for being the greatest ever.
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Schrempf Scampi
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Objectivity
Re: Hakeem vs Kareem
Of course for many it could depend on if we are comparing their careers or their respective primes.
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NBA Legend
Re: Hakeem vs Kareem
The impact of Kareem's sure skyhook I'd say was more than Hakeem's defense.
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Death Before Dishonor
Re: Hakeem vs Kareem
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Re: Hakeem vs Kareem
Career wise I'd take Jabbar but prime vs prime I'd take Olajuwon.
Olajuwon was a better defender and if they faced each other I think Jabbar would have had problem with Hakeem's speed.
Kareem was amazing but he had the luck to play with Magic Johnson, Magic was a great reason to why Jabbar had that significant length on his career, Hakeem never had a Magic by his side..
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MFFL
Re: Hakeem vs Kareem
In 18 games against each other (as the link above shows), all of which Kareem was 37 & older, Kareem put up 20 ppg on 60% fg% in just 31 mpg. At or above the age of 37!
Kareem all day, the best big man of all time.
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Re: Hakeem vs Kareem
Originally Posted by millwad
Career wise I'd take Jabbar but prime vs prime I'd take Olajuwon.
Olajuwon was a better defender and if they faced each other I think Jabbar would have had problem with Hakeem's speed.
Kareem was amazing but he had the luck to play with Magic Johnson, Magic was a great reason to why Jabbar had that significant length on his career, Hakeem never had a Magic by his side..
They DID face each other...several times. According to Psileas Kareem had his season-high game against Hakeem in the 84-85 with a 40 point performance.
In that 85-86 season, there is some question as to how often Hakeem guarded Kareem, BUT he DEFINITELY guarded Kareem in at least one game...
http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/sho...d.php?t=206575
Worthy after the game: "Kareem always plays better against Olajuwon. It's because of all the comparisons. He's been around 17 years but he still has to show the kids that he's the best."
Hakeem after the game: "He played real tough. I tried to go around him and steal the ball but he slipped around me and went to the basket."
Los Angeles Times:
While Akeem Olajuwon spent the whole game trying to steal the ball from Abdul-Jabbar, the Laker center spent the whole game throwing down a breathtaking series of hook shots on his way to a 46-point explosion.
For some reason, Rocket Coach Bill Fitch thinks it is a good idea to let Olajuwon go one-on-one with Abdul-Jabbar. It proved to be the biggest coaching blunder in any Laker game this season.
Abdul-Jabbar made 21 of 30 shots in 37 minutes to reach his high this season. He probably could have scored 50 points (his career high is 55) had he played any longer.
For that entire 85-86 regular season, in their FIVE H2H games, Kareem averaged 33.0 ppg and shot an eye-popping .634 from the field against Hakeem and the Rockets.
True, Hakeem torched LA in games three and four of the WCF's, but unfortunately for Kareem, he seemed to have SEVERAL post-seasons in which he played considerably worse than he did in the regular season. He was well below his normal averages against Wilt in their '71 WCF's (25 ppg and .481 shooting, in a year in which he averaged 31.7 ppg and shot .577.) In the '72 playoffs against Thurmond, he averaged 22.8 ppg on .405 shooting, but his superior teammates allowed him to escape to the next series against LA, where, despite 33 ppg, he only shot .457 against Wilt (and only .414 in the last four games.) In game seven of the '74 Finals, and at home, he was outplayed by 6-9 Dave Cowens (outscored, outrebounded, and outshot), although to his credit, he played exceptionally well for the rest of that series. He was outplayed by Moses in both the '81 and '83 post-season. And, he was awful in his '88 and '89 post-seasons, particularly the Finals.
Still, for a 37 and 38 year old Kareem to be just be CRUSHING a Hakeem whose numbers were not far from his peak in those years (and his shooting even better) just says it all. His 46 point game came against a 23 year old Hakeem, too. Why is that important? Because a Kareem at 23 was the league MVP, and a Finals MVP. Furthermore, Hakeem was voted first-team all-defense in the very next season (86-87), so clearly, if an over-the-hill Kareem could abuse a 23 year-old Hakeem...the assumption has to be that a PRIME Kareem would just have carpet-bombed a prime Hakeem.
BTW, Hakeem couldn't contend with Kareem's sweeping hook, but a 35 year old Wilt, at the twilight of his career, and playing on a surgically-repaired knee, could block FIFTEEN of them in the '72 WCF's.
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