Steroids in the NBA

I'm not accusing any [i]specific[/i] players of using drugs - just want to make that clear.

But steroids have been a problem in pretty much every other sport. Why would basketball be the [i]only[/i] sport that doesn't suffer from steroids? Rumors swirled around baseball players such as Bonds for many years before everyone finally admitted that yes, he obviously was using steroids. Why did it take so long for everyone to admit that he never could have gotten that big without juicing?

The NBA's drug testing policy is known to be pretty lax. It just seems like the opportunity is there, and with certain players, the superman muscles are there as well. In baseball and boxing we found out later that in virtually every case these superman looking players were juicing. Will we one day find out the same about basketball players? Players in the 80's weight trained pretty seriously but none of them looked like the freakishly cut players of today.

[img]http://docs.google.com/File?id=dd4nrbjq_739j6rm2qdn_b[/img]
[url]http://mvn.com/bucksdiary/2009/04/revisiting-my-dwight-howard-steroid-accusation.html[/url]

Wade is on it...he ain't fooling nobody...

anyone who thinks there arent any steroid users in the NBA is just naive

[QUOTE=adamcz]Players in the 80's weight trained pretty seriously but none of them looked like the freakishly cut players of today.

[img]http://docs.google.com/File?id=dd4nrbjq_739j6rm2qdn_b[/img]
[url]http://mvn.com/bucksdiary/2009/04/revisiting-my-dwight-howard-steroid-accusation.html[/url][/QUOTE]

I disagree. Most NBA players of that era starting working with weights but they don't do it seriously. They believed that getting too strong would take away their lateral quickness and throw their shot off, so yes they'd lift but not on a true serious level. When you're talking about a serious weight lifting regimen you end up looking like this:

[IMG]http://www.thedirty.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/05/cstrh23e8ggb.jpg[/IMG]

So yes guys like Dwight and Bron are huge for NBA standards, and they've bucked the stereotype that being muscular hurts your game as a basketball player, but compared to NFLers, they really don't seem [I]that[/I] big. Its just that when you see them beside long lanky guys like Tayshaun Prince and Chris Bosh that they look bigger. And seriously are either Dwight are Bron really that much bigger than Karl Malone was or Ben Wallace is?

It's interesting how many players enter NBA as muscular, but normal guys and one year later they are all superman.

Guys like Lebron and Dwight aren't really that big compared to juicers (NFL players, MLB players). They're very toned with a fair amount of muscle mass. Apart from Ben Wallace, there isn't really anyone in the NBA that comes across as being a muscle bound freak. You're kidding yourselves if you think guys like Lebron and Dwight are muscle bound. Compared to the NBA, the are bigger than average, but compared to athletes in other sports, they're not that big.

Dwyane Wade has steroid rage.

Hopefully he takes it out on his playoff opponents.

[QUOTE=Kebab Stall][B]Guys like Lebron and Dwight aren't really that big compared to juicers (NFL players, MLB players)[/B]. They're very toned with a fair amount of muscle mass. Apart from Ben Wallace, there isn't really anyone in the NBA that comes across as being a muscle bound freak. You're kidding yourselves if you think guys like Lebron and Dwight are muscle bound. Compared to the NBA, the are bigger than average, but compared to athletes in other sports, they're not that big.[/QUOTE]

This could be because they build lean muscle. Alex Rodriguez has done this and so has many other athletes. I do agree with you that LeBron isn't muscle bound like someone like the likes of Ben Wallace. He's just overall better distributing his muscles form his legs to his shoulders, Wallace has a lot skinner legs than LeBron.

[IMG]http://www.towleroad.com/images/2007/09/19/lebron2.jpg[/IMG]

[QUOTE=sodap]It's interesting how many players enter NBA as muscular, but normal guys and one year later they are all superman.[/QUOTE]
yeah, thats interesting. Oh wait, its not. Because it doesn't happen.

[QUOTE=Meticode][B]This could be because they build lean muscle.[/B] Alex Rodriguez has done this and so has many other athletes. I do agree with you that LeBron isn't muscle bound like someone like the likes of Ben Wallace. He's just overall better distributing his muscles form his legs to his shoulders, Wallace has a lot skinner legs than LeBron.

[IMG]http://www.towleroad.com/images/2007/09/19/lebron2.jpg[/IMG][/QUOTE]
Which is what I was thinking. Steroids don't just make you into a muscle bound freak straight away, you still have to work incredibly hard to get the results you want.

[IMG]http://www.grafxhq.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/06/rayallen2.jpg[/IMG]

Ray Allen.



[IMG]http://img246.imageshack.us/img246/7825/tybmdumzxdxmotg20040318pq9.jpg[/IMG]


Joey Graham has steroid rage!

^^ Is Allen thinking of going into bodybuilding or something? :wtf:

One of the things steroids do is heal damaged muscle. That's why they work. You work out, destroy muscle, and it rebuilds stronger. It's one of the reasons I thought you would see more pitchers using than hitters in baseball if you were ever able to read everyone's minds. Especially helpfull it would be for relievers who are destroying there arms three to four times a week. The quick healing turnaround steroids could provide would be huge. I'm not sure what the suspension positional breakdown would be. It'd be interesting.

All that said, I think a well thought out steroid regimen would be really beneficial to a basketball player playing four or five times a week, back to backs, three in four nights. I'm not sure if it's ingrained in the culture enough to be happening, but I wouldn't be even a little surprised, because it would probably exceptionally helpfull.

[IMG]http://img410.imageshack.us/img410/6892/karlb.jpg[/IMG]

[QUOTE=brantonli]^^ Is Allen thinking of going into bodybuilding or something? :wtf:[/QUOTE]

I'm more impressed with Joey Graham. Though he seems to have lost his passion for body building since coming into the NBA. He looks like he has added bodyfat.

Corey Maggette is another guy who has some ridiculously huge arms.

Its pretty obvious Wade is juicing. No surprise there....

[QUOTE=PleezeBelieve]Its pretty obvious Wade is juicing. No surprise there....[/QUOTE]

...

Wade isn't nearly as cut as a lot of players.

Don't be mad because he had one of the best individual seasons. It's not all about Lebron.

Anthony Mason and Maybe charles oakley were on it. heck half of the knicks squad was on it in those days.

NBA players do not use steroids. Lot's of them are ripped because they've been in great shape their whole lives, and they are put through routines designed specifically for them by professional trainers.

I'm sure that they all consume some type of supplements, but non would be considered steroids or banned substances.

[QUOTE=jmill][IMG]http://img410.imageshack.us/img410/6892/karlb.jpg[/IMG][/QUOTE]


He's a good ol country farmboy.

He spent his offseasons tossing around bails of hay.

[QUOTE=brantonli]^^ Is Allen thinking of going into bodybuilding or something? :wtf:[/QUOTE]
Allen is very cut and has lean muscle, he is far from bulked up. He would be one of the last people I suspect of taking roids.

steroids dont automatically mean you get big. like someone else mentioned a lot of times they are used to help people recover faster since the only thing steroids actually do is help muscle rebuild faster so you can workout a lot more

[img]http://imgs.sfgate.com/c/pictures/2004/12/03/mn_bonds_001_cag.jpg[/img]
^Not possible without 'roids.

[img]http://geneticsandsociety.org/images/canseco.jpg[/img]
^Not possible without 'roids.

[img]http://ptwithchris.files.wordpress.com/2007/10/a-rod-upper-body.jpg[/img]
^Not possible without 'roids.

And yet.....

[img]http://img410.imageshack.us/img410/6892/karlb.jpg[/img]

That's all natural?

Nothing natural about this

[IMG]http://slamonline.com/online/wp-content/uploads/2007/09/dwight.jpg[/IMG]

TO

[IMG]http://dimemag.com/wp-content/Images/players/Howard_Dwight/Dwight%2037-4.jpg[/IMG]

LOL

People are posting up DH12 picture from when he was [B]17[/B] years old.

This was when he was in HighSchool, probably never lifted weights (if he did he probably didnt know what the fukc he was doing) and never dieted or ate correctly.

Then he gets in the NBA, has a world class trainer with a word class weight room, has all the food he could ever want.

Obviously the guy is gonna be huge.


I seriously doubt more then 3% of the league uses steriods in the off-season.

I would say though, that during season, they are using some kind of supplement that may or may not be legal to help them recover faster

You guys are crazy, just because guys are in shape and muscular they are on roids? Like the guy above me said, they basically live with world class trainers and eat whatever they want. Eating and lifting will bulk you up FAST

[QUOTE=The_Yearning]Wade is on it...he ain't fooling nobody...[/QUOTE]

Based solely on annectdotal evidence, I wouldn't be surprised. He came back from injuries a lot better than he's ever been, and he just seems way too strong and fast for someone of his size. At the same time, he might be just that good.

The thing that concerns me about the NBA and steroids is that it's the league that would be the most likely to cover it up. More so than with any other sport, the NBA's based on individual players and their personalities; it's the only major sport where you can see the players entire heads, and there seem to be more endorsement deals for NBA players than any other sport. Add in the fact that there are already a lot of theories that the league is closer to pro wrestling than the NFL, and it wouldn't be shocking to hear that the league was covering up or intentionally ignorant of players using steroids.

Of course some NBA players are using steroids. Only the most naive people around would doubt that.

[QUOTE=Meticode]This could be because they build lean muscle. Alex Rodriguez has done this and so has many other athletes. I do agree with you that LeBron isn't muscle bound like someone like the likes of Ben Wallace. He's just overall better distributing his muscles form his legs to his shoulders, Wallace has a lot skinner legs than LeBron.

[IMG]http://www.towleroad.com/images/2007/09/19/lebron2.jpg[/IMG][/QUOTE]
old picture on the abc pregame it showed lebron recently and he is way more ripped and bulkier

is this the new way to bash players on ish? instead of bashing their fans it'll become player ___ sucks because he's obviously on steroids.

if i had to pick one guy in the nba to test for steroids, it would be d-wade. i doubt he uses them, but the guy is ripped now and his head looks bigger.

There is nothing unnatural about a player being a lot bigger in their 20's then when they are 17-18. The additional working out also comes in handy.

I went from 190lbs at 17 (6'4) to 227 now that I'm in my early 20's and I didn't even work out much. Nope, it's not fat.

you don't need steroids to build any physique ever seen in the NBA. steroids will certainly get you there *quicker* than you could get there without steroids, but you can still do it plenty fast without them.

all NBA players have access to very highly paid and knowledgeable trainers and nutritionists, and a lot of guys also have personal chefs who work with their nutritionists to build meal plans for them, etc. those factors and their activity levels add up considerably.

this guy is a natural pro bodybuilder... he uses supplements like creatine, whey, casein, nitrous oxide boosters, etc... but nothing horomonal. no steroids, and no insulin + HGH cocktails.

Layne Norton:

[img]http://forum.bodybuilding.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=301578&d=1147046283[/img]

in that pic, he's in contest shape--about 1-2% lower than the lowest bodyfat percentages in the NBA.

another natural pro, Jim Cordova:

[img]http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_rDNyQdDXib8/SGo5CZgj51I/AAAAAAAABMg/_Pz2c0qSNJQ/s400/267d.jpg[/img]

now... neither of these guys would hold up well in an IFBB show like the Arnold Classic, or the Mr Olympia... because they'd be facing guys whose bodies you really *can't* attain without juice.

for contrast, here's a guy known for being 'small' by IFBB standards... Dexter "The Blade" Jackson:

[img]http://graysmatter.codivation.com/content/binary/dexter_jackson.jpg[/img]

to put it in perspective, Dexter is 1" taller than Cordova (they're both shrimps, btw... 5'6" and 5'7"), and Dex outweighs Jim by over 40 pounds.

i would actually guess that steroid use in the NBA is *very* rare. in most instances, it would probably be guys cheating rehab work, etc and trying to come back quicker. unfortunately, while steroids are great for building muscle, they don't do s**t for tendons, ligaments, bones, etc.

i definitely don't think it's out of the question that some guys have given it a shot just to try to increase performance, though.

[QUOTE=Biddy77]you don't need steroids to build any physique ever seen in the NBA. steroids will certainly get you there *quicker* than you could get there without steroids, but you can still do it plenty fast without them.

all NBA players have access to very highly paid and knowledgeable trainers and nutritionists, and a lot of guys also have personal chefs who work with their nutritionists to build meal plans for them, etc. those factors and their activity levels add up considerably.

this guy is a natural pro bodybuilder... he uses supplements like creatine, whey, casein, nitrous oxide boosters, etc... but nothing horomonal. no steroids, and no insulin + HGH cocktails.

Layne Norton:

[img]http://forum.bodybuilding.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=301578&d=1147046283[/img]

in that pic, he's in contest shape--about 1-2% lower than the lowest bodyfat percentages in the NBA.

another natural pro, Jim Cordova:

[img]http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_rDNyQdDXib8/SGo5CZgj51I/AAAAAAAABMg/_Pz2c0qSNJQ/s400/267d.jpg[/img]

now... neither of these guys would hold up well in an IFBB show like the Arnold Classic, or the Mr Olympia... because they'd be facing guys whose bodies you really *can't* attain without juice.

for contrast, here's a guy known for being 'small' by IFBB standards... Dexter "The Blade" Jackson:

[img]http://graysmatter.codivation.com/content/binary/dexter_jackson.jpg[/img]

to put it in perspective, Dexter is 1" taller than Cordova (they're both shrimps, btw... 5'6" and 5'7"), and Dex outweighs Jim by over 40 pounds.

i would actually guess that steroid use in the NBA is *very* rare. in most instances, it would probably be guys cheating rehab work, etc and trying to come back quicker. unfortunately, while steroids are great for building muscle, they don't do s**t for tendons, ligaments, bones, etc.

i definitely don't think it's out of the question that some guys have given it a shot just to try to increase performance, though.[/QUOTE]

nice post, this also brings up a point that irritates me so much. People will always say X player is on steroids because he has muscles, while it is impossible to tell and its not even remotely accurate to tell if someone is juicing. look at baseball pitchers for example, hardly any of them are cut and most just look like an average joe and a lot of pitchers juice.

[QUOTE=BrentISballin]You guys are crazy, just because guys are in shape and muscular they are on roids? Like the guy above me said, they basically live with world class trainers and eat whatever they want. Eating and lifting will bulk you up FAST[/QUOTE]
Baseball players have the same exact world class trainers, and yet every baseball player who bulked up later turned out to have done so with steroids. Five or ten years ago, fans were defending the baseball players, saying that it's the world class trainers and nutrition that made them so big, but they were wrong.

If baseball players can't do it the natural way, why should basketball players have that ability?

[QUOTE=adamcz]Baseball players have the same exact world class trainers, and yet every baseball player who bulked up later turned out to have done so with steroids. Five or ten years ago, fans were defending the baseball players, saying that it's the world class trainers and nutrition that made them so big, but they were wrong.

If baseball players can't do it the natural way, why should basketball players have that ability?[/QUOTE]

the issue here is that you said "if baseball players [b]can't[/b] do it the natural way", which is wrong, frankly.

at some point in time, steroids became an issue in baseball, and other players started short-cutting to get there quicker. word spreads quickly, and BOOM! it becomes a pervasive issue.

i have never seen a baseball player whose physique was unattainable without steroids. steroids make it quicker, and they make it easier.

also, consider the reason for steroids being popular with baseball players... pitching, and hitting. quick, powerful movements. football, same thing. players are generally dynamic for brief periods of time.

in sports like basketball, hockey, and soccer, you're on the move for more sustained periods of time, and steroids would have a less notable direct impact on a player's performance. they could help with things like holding position, explosive leaping, etc... but they aren't going to make you a better shooter, ball handler, give you better footwork, etc.

thus, the risk vs reward is a lot less agreeable.

[QUOTE=Biddy77]the issue here is that you said "if baseball players [b]can't[/b] do it the natural way", which is wrong, frankly.

at some point in time, steroids became an issue in baseball, and other players started short-cutting to get there quicker. word spreads quickly, and BOOM! it becomes a pervasive issue.

i have never seen a baseball player whose physique was unattainable without steroids. steroids make it quicker, and they make it easier.

also, consider the reason for steroids being popular with baseball players... pitching, and hitting. quick, powerful movements. football, same thing. players are generally dynamic for brief periods of time.

in sports like basketball, hockey, and soccer, you're on the move for more sustained periods of time, and steroids would have a less notable direct impact on a player's performance. they could help with things like holding position, explosive leaping, etc... [B]but they aren't going to make you a better shooter, ball handler, give you better footwork, etc. [/B]

thus, the risk vs reward is a lot less agreeable.[/QUOTE]


A lot of that is true, but similar things could be said about baseball. At the end of the day, you have to put the bat on the ball squarely, or throw the thing where you want to throw it, and neither one of those things is going to be helped by steroids.

I think the real point is that these pro sport jobs are incredibly rare commodities, that lead to untold riches and a degree of fame to even it's worst holders. And these guys are all by nature incredibly competitive. If someone gets in there ear saying this thing will help you, the guy on the fringe is not unlikely to bite. And the ability to aid recovery I think would be a very appealing element for a pro basketball player.

Like I said, I just don't think it's pervaded the culture of basketball yet. But I doubt that there's this many competitive, physical guys, making living with their bodies, and not one of them has been used a PED. Maybe it's the pessimest in me, who knows.

[QUOTE=Thorpesaurous]A lot of that is true, but similar things could be said about baseball. At the end of the day, you have to put the bat on the ball squarely, or throw the thing where you want to throw it, and neither one of those things is going to be helped by steroids.

I think the real point is that these pro sport jobs are incredibly rare commodities, that lead to untold riches and a degree of fame to even it's worst holders. And these guys are all by nature incredibly competitive. If someone gets in there ear saying this thing will help you, the guy on the fringe is not unlikely to bite. And the ability to aid recovery I think would be a very appealing element for a pro basketball player.

Like I said, I just don't think it's pervaded the culture of basketball yet. But I doubt that there's this many competitive, physical guys, making living with their bodies, and not one of them has been used a PED. Maybe it's the pessimest in me, who knows.[/QUOTE]

agreed. my point with baseball was just to highlight the power aspects of pitching and hitting, in which raw power can make a dramatic difference. pitch speed and batting distance are big deals in the sport.

generally speaking, i do agree with your post, as usual.

it's possible to completely dominate basketball as a skinny ass or even unathletic player. muscle mass/raw power is advantageous but not mandatory. whether steroids are helping basketball players or not is not even a concerned issue because it just isn't an issue. nobody cares in this sport because it's not even close to the major factor to whether a guy is just average or pretty good. it doesn't greatly enhance your game. steroids don't help you make a jump shot or a nice pass. if you're a good basketball player who happens to be big, you're just good because you got game, certainly not because you're taking steroids.

in other sports like baseball, it's not the same because the effects are much more realized and player might consider the results. if he doesn't take steroids, he might be hitting just 25HR. but if he decided to inject it up his ass, he might potentionally be hitting 40HR and be the man. that's significant enough to practically make the entire league care enough to trade off their testicles for sports performances. you don't need to be a rocket science to figure out that no skinny guy is ever dominating the bat or leading the league in home runs. those guys all take steroids because it's a much more significant performance enhancer for them, and it's a critical element, but basketball? shiiit, it's just a stupid issue because being just big and strong don't mean much because that alone won't make an average player into a superstar player. if you're just a 10-5 guy, taking roids won't elevate you to a 20-10 player. it's not some instant magical potion like it might be for other sports.

this is not an issue in the nba because nobody friggin cares for all the reasons above.

[QUOTE=DCL]it's possible to completely dominate basketball as a skinny ass or even unathletic player. muscle mass/raw power is advantageous but not mandatory. whether steroids are helping basketball players or not is not even a concerned issue because it just isn't an issue. nobody cares in this sport because it's not even close to the major factor to whether a guy is just average or pretty good. it doesn't greatly enhance your game. steroids don't help you make a jump shot or a nice pass. if you're a good basketball player who happens to be big, you're just good because you got game, certainly not because you're taking steroids.

in other sports like baseball, it's not the same because the effects are much more realized and player might consider the results. if he doesn't take steroids, he might be hitting just 25HR. but if he decided to inject it up his ass, he might potentionally be hitting 40HR and be the man. that's significant enough to practically make the entire league care enough to trade off their testicles for sports performances. you don't need to be a rocket science to figure out that no skinny guy is ever dominating the bat or leading the league in home runs. those guys all take steroids because it's a much more significant performance enhancer for them, and it's a critical element, but basketball? shiiit, it's just a stupid issue because being just big and strong don't mean much because that alone won't make an average player into a superstar player. if you're just a 10-5 guy, taking roids won't elevate you to a 20-10 player. it's not some instant magical potion like it might be for other sports.

this is not an issue in the nba because nobody friggin cares for all the reasons above.[/QUOTE]
steroids could make you a faster player and stronger which would help you a lot in rebounds. they could help you jump higher which would give you a higher chance to block shots. please dont act like steroids wouldnt have any impact in the nba. look at shawn green, he is skinny and has hit a bunch of home runs in the past. 20 years ago nobody cared or thought steroids was a problem in the mlb but oh boy now a days it seems like everyone does them.