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Hello all,
i would like to get some of your advices on how to protect the ball while driving in for a lay up? i always get stripped by smaller or same size players when i already picked up the ball and in my steps to the lay up, is there a way to prevent that or at least make it a foul so they cant get a clean strip?
THANKS!
Usually people don't try to steal the ball from me when I drive, but when they do, I take advantage of it. Sometimes, when I drive I grip the ball between my hand and arm, or I palm it, and I bring it halfway behind my back. They think I'm going to throw a behind the back pass and stop running to try to deflect it.
Like this:
[url]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bwOjU9gtF5U&feature=PlayList&p=76DC23C9C814E9B4&index=55&playnext=2&playnext_from=PL[/url]
Or if they players are smaller than you, like you mentioned, I would lay up like this
[url]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rhzNdD-1hg0[/url]
I wouldn't necessarily go reverse, but I'd keep the ball above my head.
If you want a foul, cradle the ball with two hands and let them hack at you.
It's so easy to steal you the ball when you keep the ball above your head .. Or normally you fail the shoot when you got some opposition :s
When i go to do a lay up, i try to put the ball close to my chest and grab around like when you're fighting to get the ball. Wade do that all the time.
I cradle it like a running back
Learn to cuff the ball. It makes you hold it strongly then also makes your elbow just so happen to be right there which prevents too much reaching and lunging in. See LeBron, Marbury, Melo, Kobe, highlights of them driving the lane.
[QUOTE=rosonviyavong]I cradle it like a running back[/QUOTE]
That's what i tried to say, Wade do that all the time
[QUOTE=Maga_1]That's what i tried to say, Wade do that all the time[/QUOTE]
Yeah
[QUOTE=rosonviyavong]I cradle it like a running back[/QUOTE]
I do that a lot too. I actually got the idea from marbury...
[QUOTE=The_Night_Elf]I do that a lot too. I actually got the idea from marbury...[/QUOTE]
Same :cheers:
I do this, and I'm the only person I've ever seen to do it...
I don't even protect the ball really, I actually do some slight of hand.
I put my opposite hand like I'm about to lay the ball up (empty handed, think of it like playing air guitar) then I bring my hand back down and actually go up for the lay-up
You'd be shocked on how many people that move jukes
woo hoo, thanks all, i think got an idea now
i will try to cradle or cuff the ball, it just sucks that people or help defense are stirpping me after i burnt the first man and it sometimes goes out of bounds on my knee too.
[QUOTE=JG000]I do this, and I'm the only person I've ever seen to do it...
I don't even protect the ball really, I actually do some slight of hand.
I put my opposite hand like I'm about to lay the ball up (empty handed, think of it like playing air guitar) then I bring my hand back down and actually go up for the lay-up
You'd be shocked on how many people that move jukes[/QUOTE]
you got a clip? lol kinda hard to visualize it
All of these are solid ideas. My contribution is to simply remind you that if have picked up your dribble, you're free to do whatever you want with the ball in those two strides of variable length. I do not have a set way of handling the ball when slipping into the lane, it's more about making split reactions based off of what will best protect the rock and take me to the rim. Sometimes I'll cuff, or hold like a running back, or even take the ball over my head and through the middle of two defenders attempting to converge.
On a fast break layup, I was always taught not to rock the ball back near my waist after I picked up my dribble (your body's natural movement will make you want to do so). A key is to keep the ball all the way in front of your body to cut down on someone trailing behind and stripping the ball away.
[QUOTE=623baller]Hello all,
i would like to get some of your advices on how to protect the ball while driving in for a lay up? i always get stripped by smaller or same size players when i already picked up the ball and in my steps to the lay up, is there a way to prevent that or at least make it a foul so they cant get a clean strip?
THANKS![/QUOTE]
Are you serious? you posted in my other thread that you dropped 34 pts in a game with 8-10 assists and you have problems with this? :wtf:
[QUOTE=Maga_1][B]It's so easy to steal you the ball when you keep the ball above your head[/B] .. Or normally you fail the shoot when you got some opposition :s
When i go to do a lay up, i try to put the ball close to my chest and grab around like when you're fighting to get the ball. Wade do that all the time.[/QUOTE]
Are you trying to say keeping the ball up high makes it easier to steal? You want to keep the ball up high so you can draw contact and keep it away from the defender. If you put it LOW, you are asking for defenders to knock it away or wrap you up and ref calls "jumpball"
[QUOTE=Automajic23]Are you serious? you posted in my other thread that you dropped 34 pts in a game with 8-10 assists and you have problems with this? :wtf:[/QUOTE]
:roll:
yes i do have this problem espeically against defensive oriented guards!
what does dropping 34 pts and having 8~10 assists have to do with this?
i usually pass and hit the open man before i get stripped but sometimes i need to buy a bucket or go to the line, i rather take it to the hole if you know what i mean , but when i try to do that, i always seem to mess it up hence i am here to get your advices to elevate my game :)
[QUOTE=JG000]I do this, and I'm the only person I've ever seen to do it...
I don't even protect the ball really, I actually do some slight of hand.
I put my opposite hand like I'm about to lay the ball up (empty handed, think of it like playing air guitar) then I bring my hand back down and actually go up for the lay-up
You'd be shocked on how many people that move jukes[/QUOTE]
You're the only person to do it? :oldlol:
I've seen so many people do it and it's not that good.
[QUOTE=shlver]You're the only person to do it? :oldlol:
I've seen so many people do it and it's not that good.[/QUOTE]
Good to know. I play with 15-20 different people at the park, and never see anyone else do it. A couple even question if it's legal.
And it works well enough for me. Opens up the lane every time.
[QUOTE=shlver]You're the only person to do it? :oldlol:
I've seen so many people do it and it's not that good.[/QUOTE]
you can't hate on the move if it works, and he is probably playing with underskilled people so it fools them frequent, but IT WORKS.
Play your game how you will in your environment
[QUOTE=623baller]:roll:
yes i do have this problem espeically against defensive oriented guards!
what does dropping 34 pts and having 8~10 assists have to do with this?
i usually pass and hit the open man before i get stripped but sometimes i need to buy a bucket or go to the line, i rather take it to the hole if you know what i mean , but when i try to do that, i always seem to mess it up hence i am here to get your advices to elevate my game :)[/QUOTE]
So you can score 34 pts in a game, but if someone actually plays defense on you, you instantly suck?
You can't possibly have the IQ and talent to distribute 8-10 dimes and get 34 points without knowing how to protect the ball driving to the basket unless:
-The competition your playing is terrible
-Your team is amazingly good and you are getting wide open looks and taking a high volume of shots
-you were literally on fire for a day
Unless you are experiencing 1 of those 3 you can't possibly drop a 34-10ast line if you can't do something as basic as protect the ball going to the rim :wtf:
The only reason I score >>>> 20 pts in a game is because the team I'm playing on can't score or because I'm ballhogging, and the other teams D is suspect. When I actually play against legit competition in a game I won't score more than 10-16pts. Layups are probably the easiest way to get a basket how can you not know how to do it?
[QUOTE=Automajic23]you can't hate on the move if it works, and he is probably playing with underskilled people so it fools them frequent, but IT WORKS.
Play your game how you will in your environment[/QUOTE]
Not hating on the move. You can maybe use it one or two times, but after that the defender should learn to wait and block that ****.
[QUOTE=shlver]Not hating on the move. You can maybe use it one or two times, but after that the defender should learn to wait and block that ****.[/QUOTE]
I'm sure the defender isn't even playing defense. He said he scored 34 pts in a game, but can't even do something basic like this properly.
[QUOTE=Automajic23]I'm sure the defender isn't even playing defense. He said he scored 34 pts in a game, but can't even do something basic like this properly.[/QUOTE]
Maybe he was taking jump shots all game.:confusedshrug: seriously though, you make a good point. I have never seen a guy get even 20PTS and 10 Assts if they don't know simple things like protecting the ball on a drive. Especially if the guy in playing PG. 34 and 10 sounds like himself and his teammates were on fire and hitting everything and the other team had no concept of how to play defense. Those two things combined is the only way I see that happening.
Sorry Baller, I don't mean to p!ss in your cereal or nothing it's jsut a bit shocking to hear this. If it went down then good on you man.:applause: As for protecting the ball I also try to keep it high and keep it moving depending on where the defenders are, as well as sometimes hold it like a running back...
[QUOTE=The_Night_Elf]Maybe he was taking jump shots all game.:confusedshrug: seriously though, you make a good point. I have never seen a guy get even 20PTS and 10 Assts if they don't know simple things like protecting the ball on a drive. Especially if the guy in playing PG. 34 and 10 sounds like himself and his teammates were on fire and hitting everything and the other team had no concept of how to play defense. Those two things combined is the only way I see that happening.
Sorry Baller, I don't mean to p!ss in your cereal or nothing it's jsut a bit shocking to hear this. If it went down then good on you man.:applause: As for protecting the ball I also try to keep it high and keep it moving depending on where the defenders are, as well as sometimes hold it like a running back...[/QUOTE]
Right
[QUOTE=Automajic23]Are you serious? you posted in my other thread that you dropped 34 pts in a game with 8-10 assists and you have problems with this? :wtf:[/QUOTE]
There is a perfect explaination for that This is his competition level
[IMG]http://www.grandpag.com/images/2007%20Thanksgiving/school/kindergarten1107.jpg[/IMG]
LOL Automagic, you lmao,
i guess i can't be more of a pure shooter type of player? i avg 20 pts a game in recent years leagues/tournaments with a mix of 3s and mid range jumpshots against people that played high school varsity, but i guess they suck too?
yea, i did mention in my other post, the other teams guards were turning the ball over like crazy that's why i even scored 34 (i had a shiet load of 1 man fast breaks), and i probably shot probably 85% fg wise and i hit all my free throws. It was a brag post, and you would expect me to not post there when i scored 34? did i also not mention i didn't even play the entire game? i could probably have gone for 40~45? LOL but to your point , yea i would consider that game terrible competition at the guard positions which gave me the edge.
for impossible to hand out close to 10 assists comment:
like i said in earlier posts, i dish the ball before they even strip/double me that's how i got my assists from ( when i burn the first guy or when people doubles me, i always find the open man, i m also good at organizing fast breaks and that's where most of my assists came from). if you want to call hitting the open man and passing before d sets up, no bball IQ, then whatever floats your boat.
i just played a decent guard, he didnt even attempt a lay up the entire game, and he had 25 + because he was lighting the 3 up, so again, that just proves everyone has a different style of play and different scoring methods. but i do agree with you that protecting the ball while driving is important that's why i even made the post because once i got that down, i am gona be unstoppable inside and out.
i'll let my game speak for myself, hopefully we do one of those forum meets one of these days, im sure i got lots to learn from yall
[QUOTE=The_Night_Elf]Maybe he was taking jump shots all game.:confusedshrug: seriously though, you make a good point. I have never seen a guy get even 20PTS and 10 Assts if they don't know simple things like protecting the ball on a drive. Especially if the guy in playing PG. 34 and 10 sounds like himself and his teammates were on fire and hitting everything and the other team had no concept of how to play defense. Those two things combined is the only way I see that happening.
Sorry Baller, I don't mean to p!ss in your cereal or nothing it's jsut a bit shocking to hear this. If it went down then good on you man.:applause: As for protecting the ball I also try to keep it high and keep it moving depending on where the defenders are, as well as sometimes hold it like a running back...[/QUOTE]
yea i definitely agree with you and him on this that's why i wana improve my game by getting advices from you guys, but i guess i should also be more specific on my style of play which is in the above thread :hammerhead:
i should probably also be more specific about my question too. i do protect the ball while driving (you guys made me sound like i dont at all) but i do a horrible job of it, i guess i am asking how to [B]effectively[/B] protect the ball while driving in , i cut the d up pretty good, just that sometimes i rather take it in myself then pass it off when i drew the double or help defense came that's where the strip occurs (the defender strips from behind or side)
[QUOTE=623baller]LOL Automagic, you lmao,
i guess i can't be more of a pure shooter type of player? i avg 20 pts a game in recent years leagues/tournaments with a mix of 3s and mid range jumpshots against people that played high school varsity, but i guess they suck too?
yea, i did mention in my other post, the other teams guards were turning the ball over like crazy that's why i even scored 34 (i had a shiet load of 1 man fast breaks), and i probably shot probably 85% fg wise and i hit all my free throws. It was a brag post, and you would expect me to not post there when i scored 34? did i also not mention i didn't even play the entire game? i could probably have gone for 40~45? LOL but to your point , yea i would consider that game terrible competition at the guard positions which gave me the edge.
for impossible to hand out close to 10 assists comment:
like i said in earlier posts, i dish the ball before they even strip/double me that's how i got my assists from ( when i burn the first guy or when people doubles me, i always find the open man, i m also good at organizing fast breaks and that's where most of my assists came from). if you want to call hitting the open man and passing before d sets up, no bball IQ, then whatever floats your boat.
i just played a decent guard, he didnt even attempt a lay up the entire game, and he had 25 + because he was lighting the 3 up, so again, that just proves everyone has a different style of play and different scoring methods. but i do agree with you that protecting the ball while driving is important that's why i even made the post because once i got that down, i am gona be unstoppable inside and out.
i'll let my game speak for myself, hopefully we do one of those forum meets one of these days, im sure i got lots to learn from yall[/QUOTE]
IDK man big numbers like that are just not realistic at all, not even @ AAU level.
Players generally don't drop 20-30 a game unless their team sucks, the offense is built purely around them, or the other team is terrible.
34 pts = 17 shot opportunities at least, 11.5 if you sank 11 3s and a layup. Just think about the numbers you are posting, not realistic unless the talent you are playing with is way below you.
Like I said, when I've played with better teams in the past, scoring 10-14pts was HIGH for me, because the team is GOOD. There is no reason for me to try to score more or I'd hurt my team. When you're on a good team that can attack in many ways efficiently, scoring more than 16pts is farfetched unless everything stopped working and you needed to "lebron" it in the closing minutes.
Just think about the game you described. 34pts with 10 asts. I posted a game where I scored 43pts once, but my team was horrible and I had the ball in my hands almost every possession and did not sit. The other team also had no bench so I literally ran down the court and layed it in (probably about 12 times). It was a high scoring game for me against a crappy team, with a crappier team cuz we still lost.
If you can drop 34, I honestly think the way you protect the ball going up is perfectly fine. If you are dropping 20+ pts on a legit team against legit comp then you shouldn't be taking advice from me because you are probably far better.
[QUOTE=shlver]Not hating on the move. You can maybe use it one or two times, but after that the defender should learn to wait and block that ****.[/QUOTE]
I usually do it once a game.
I always do flashy stuff like that, and I over-exaggerate all my ball fakes.
They work [I]most [/I]of the time.
But my competition isn't that great :confusedshrug:
Edit: Nevermind, story was too long.
[QUOTE=Automajic23]IDK man big numbers like that are just not realistic at all, not even @ AAU level.
Players generally don't drop 20-30 a game unless their team sucks, the offense is built purely around them, or the other team is terrible.
34 pts = 17 shot opportunities at least, 11.5 if you sank 11 3s and a layup. Just think about the numbers you are posting, not realistic unless the talent you are playing with is way below you.
Like I said, when I've played with better teams in the past, scoring 10-14pts was HIGH for me, because the team is GOOD. There is no reason for me to try to score more or I'd hurt my team. When you're on a good team that can attack in many ways efficiently, scoring more than 16pts is farfetched unless everything stopped working and you needed to "lebron" it in the closing minutes.
Just think about the game you described. 34pts with 10 asts. I posted a game where I scored 43pts once, but my team was horrible and I had the ball in my hands almost every possession and did not sit. The other team also had no bench so I literally ran down the court and layed it in (probably about 12 times). It was a high scoring game for me against a crappy team, with a crappier team cuz we still lost.
If you can drop 34, I honestly think the way you protect the ball going up is perfectly fine. If you are dropping 20+ pts on a legit team against legit comp then you shouldn't be taking advice from me because you are probably far better.[/QUOTE]
yea, i guess i get to score that much because offense is usually built around me. i am usually the first or second option when running offensive sets, so avging 20 ppg for me is not a stretch goal. the only reason why im even playing PG this season is because im the only guard on the team, rest are all bigs or athletic types.
and yea 34 ( 3 3pters, 4 mid range jumpers, 5 lay ups/paint, 7 free throws) is my career high so far that's why i kinda bragged about it haha, let alone i handed off close to 10 assists, and sat out the last 5 mins.:cheers: (there was a big mismatch at the guard position, and the other team's guards keeps turning the ball over)
credits of the assists all goes to my teammates for running the lane and keeping the spacing just right so we capitalized on every fast break. no way i can do that without competent teammates.
thanks again for your advices though, i do agree with a lot of your view points on this and several other topics, and they are very well appreciated! i guess i wasn't too specific in terms of my style of play and question which led to the :wtf:
[QUOTE=Automajic23]
-The competition your playing is terrible
-Your team is amazingly good and you are getting wide open looks and taking a high volume of shots
-you were literally on fire for a day
QUOTE]
[QUOTE=Automajic23]IDK man big numbers like that are just not realistic at all, not even @ AAU level.
Players generally don't drop 20-30 a game unless their team sucks, the offense is built purely around them, or the other team is terrible.
.[/QUOTE]
How tall is 623balller and how much does he weight, what's his vertical like?
to 623baller and automajic:
I believe 100% of 623baller 34 point 10 assist game. I do agree it is hard to go 30 and 10 or even 10 and 10, but not impossible.
I have a friend who is 16 years old 5'11 plays both varsity and AAu ball in the ghetto of New York. He dropped 50 points in one of his AAU games. Here's what he said happened in his own words.
[I]u can say both..i concentrated like 2hours b4 the game deep concentration..becuz i was madd we lost b4..so i said to myself we not losing..so when the game start i hit a 3 and my coach told me to do my thang
they kept switching up..man & zone
in zone thats when i killed them
cause i was hot so i was hitting crazy 3s and when they came out to me it was a punfake and 1dribble pullup or take it to the rack
i didnt even get winded that game i was that focused[/I]
About the crazy stats numbers and competition: Though the team 623baller was playing was garbage. Some players game gets better as the competition gets better. Their is no finer example then our very own lilojmayo. It doesn't matter if lilojmayo is playing against guys who don't have enough skills to play HS ball or guys 10 years older then him. He still puts up numbers. 30+ scoring games, trouble doubles, flirts with quadruple doubles. He is averaging like 31 PPG his last 5 league games.
I think dab0yech0 said lilojmayo was a 20/10 machine that is a career game for most.
I have been getting stripped when I blow past my defender a lot lately, I dont know what is going on with that. Good news is, my fadeaway is back and my defense has gotten better. Tip to all: Do not, I repeat, do not take an extended break from basketball.
Are they ripping you when you get passed them poking the ball from behind while you're still trying to dribble, or are they stripping you when you get ready to go up for a layup at that point where you put both hands on the ball right before going up (I'm great at this)?
[img]http://my.nba.com/servlet/JiveServlet/download/300018258-300018828-300465752-300051196/%2Fmedia%2Fdgibson_627_071217.jpg[/img]
I'm going to use this picture to illustrate
If it's the first, when you get passed a defender, don't assume all is done and he is out of the play. You're Mo Williams. Gibson's stance is slightly staggered, he's trying to force you right/middle so let's just assume you're going to take that and go middle (although, given the choice if you attack the defender's frontmost foot [in this case going to Gibson's right, your left, it'll take them longer to recover]).
Once you get fully passed him with a right handed dribble, your next dribble has to either be a crossover back to your left hand while totally cutting him off or a long dribble (far ahead of you and catching up to it), to prevent him from swinging around your right shoulder and poking it with your left hand.
As he's giving chance, you might even want to make contact with him on your back so you can feel what side of you he is on as well as seal him off from getting back in front of you (CP3 and Deron Williams are great at this), then make your next move knowing where he is and that your team now has a 5 on 4 advantage because he is totally out of the play defensively being that he is behind you.
[QUOTE=phoenix18]I have been getting stripped when I blow past my defender a lot lately, I dont know what is going on with that. Good news is, my fadeaway is back and my defense has gotten better. Tip to all: Do not, I repeat, do not take an extended break from basketball.[/QUOTE]
I here ya man. I took about a 3 week break and I could barely even dribble when I started back again. And for protecting the ball just hold that **** as if it where a billion dollars.
[QUOTE=MannyO]I here ya man. I took about a 3 week break and I could barely even dribble when I started back again. And for protecting the ball just hold that **** as if it where a billion dollars.[/QUOTE]
:oldlol: If it was a billion dollars, I would lay it up either. I was talking about dribbling past the guy and he strips from behind, which has never happened to me before, but this guy I play against is doing it to me about 50% of the time. Yesterday, I destroyed him scoring 20 on him and we were playing one's and two's. Couldnt drive past him that well without getting stripped though.
[QUOTE=50inchvertical]Are they ripping you when you get passed them poking the ball from behind while you're still trying to dribble, or are they stripping you when you get ready to go up for a layup at that point where you put both hands on the ball right before going up (I'm great at this)?
I'm going to use this picture to illustrate
If it's the first, when you get passed a defender, don't assume all is done and he is out of the play. You're Mo Williams. Gibson's stance is slightly staggered, he's trying to force you right/middle so let's just assume you're going to take that and go middle (although, given the choice if you attack the defender's frontmost foot [in this case going to Gibson's right, your left, it'll take them longer to recover]).
Once you get fully passed him with a right handed dribble, your next dribble has to either be a crossover back to your left hand while totally cutting him off or a long dribble (far ahead of you and catching up to it), to prevent him from swinging around your right shoulder and poking it with your left hand.
As he's giving chance, you might even want to make contact with him on your back so you can feel what side of you he is on as well as seal him off from getting back in front of you (CP3 and Deron Williams are great at this), then make your next move knowing where he is and that your team now has a 5 on 4 advantage because he is totally out of the play defensively being that he is behind you.[/QUOTE]
Yeah, I will practice this over the weekend. Thanks.
[QUOTE=phoenix18]:oldlol: If it was a billion dollars, I would lay it up either. I was talking about dribbling past the guy and he strips from behind, which has never happened to me before, but this guy I play against is doing it to me about 50% of the time. Yesterday, I destroyed him scoring 20 on him and we were playing one's and two's. Couldnt drive past him that well without getting stripped though.
Yeah, I will practice this over the weekend. Thanks.[/QUOTE]
I have a problem with getting stripped from behind too because I'm really short.
I just do a extra little bounce so they can't reach the ball.
[QUOTE=phoenix18]:oldlol: If it was a billion dollars, I would lay it up either. I was talking about dribbling past the guy and he strips from behind, which has never happened to me before, but this guy I play against is doing it to me about 50% of the time. Yesterday, I destroyed him scoring 20 on him and we were playing one's and two's. Couldnt drive past him that well without getting stripped though.
Yeah, I will practice this over the weekend. Thanks.[/QUOTE]
Did the picture not show up for you? If not, I'll host it myself. It's somewhat crucial to what I was explaining, or helps a bunch to see it.
If "And 1's manager" didn't steal my ****ing camera I'd post some vids of myself playing as I put this type of stuff into play regularly.
Sometimes you just have to see it. Check out youtube.com , search for "Ganon Baker" and subscribe to both his user names. They have great lessons on there
[QUOTE=50inchvertical]Did the picture not show up for you? If not, I'll host it myself. It's somewhat crucial to what I was explaining, or helps a bunch to see it.
If "And 1's manager" didn't steal my ****ing camera I'd post some vids of myself playing as I put this type of stuff into play regularly.
Sometimes you just have to see it. Check out youtube.com , search for "Ganon Baker" and subscribe to both his user names. They have great lessons on there[/QUOTE]
Yeah, I can see the picture, just left it out the quote so that the page doesnt get too big. I am **** about things like that.:oldlol: I just saw Ganon Baker and his associate Micah. Those guys are awesome and I was shocked at how good they were. I thought I was good and now I feel like crap after seeing them.
[QUOTE=phoenix18] I just saw Ganon Baker and his associate Micah. Those guys are awesome and I was shocked at how good they were. I thought I was good and now I feel like crap after seeing them.[/QUOTE]
You and everybody else. They're amazing.