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Old 07-28-2012, 05:10 AM   #149
Shep
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Default Re: Barkley: I'm better than Malone

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'92? Stockton managed just 14.3 ppg and 11.2 apg on a terrible 39.7% compared to a 15.8 ppg, 13.7 apg, 48.2% season. Stockton's numbers are lowered by him being forced to leave sit out the second half of game 5. But in the elimination game, Stockton had 18 points and 12 assists, but on 5/19 shooting and 1/8 on 3s with 5 turnovers.
overall, stockton had a successful playoffs. the jazz made the conference finals, one of only 4 teams to get to the conference finals, and it was the first time in the history of the franchise they had made it that far.

and why are you mentioning only 1 series? overall he averaged 14.8ppg, 2.9apg, 13.6apg, and 2.1spg. including a masterful 16.0ppg, 3.6rpg, 16.0apg, 2.0spg series against the la clippers, and 14.2ppg, 3.2rpg, 14.0apg, 3.2spg series against gary payton and the seattle supersonics.

as for that final game stockton was playing out of his game by shooting too much because karl malone was being passive, only taking 14 shots.
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Stockton was extremely quiet in the '94 WCF. He fell from 15.2 ppg and 12.6 apg on 52.8% in the season to 14.4 ppg and 9.4 apg on 41.5% including quiet games of 17 points/6 assists in a key game 5 that pretty much decided if Utah would make it a series, and an elimination game of 13 points and 9 assists on 6/19 shooting.
again, 1 series. the jazz made the conference finals again, 1 out of only 4 teams to do so, and lost to the eventual champion, and much stronger houston rockets.

they shouldn't have even been in the wcf in the first place, but they destroyed the powerful san antonio spurs in 4 games in the first round without home court advantage, then defeated the team that just got done beating the team with the best record in the nba, all while jeff hornacek was still getting used to his new surroundings.

stockton was once again forced to take shots in game 7 due to other people not stepping up.
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In the '96 WCF, Stockton dropped to 9.9 ppg and 7.6 apg on 39.7% compared to his season averages of 14.7 ppg and 11.2 apg on 53.8%.
one series and another wcf appearance 1 of only 4 teams to do so defeated the san antonio spurs again without homecourt advantage.

stockton didn't have a particularily good wcf, but a main reason behind that was due to him being matched up with the best point guard in the nba, and also one of the best defenders in the league. stockton was only a top 3 point guard by this stage. but lets have a look at what he did in the first 2 rounds:

against portland: 14.2ppg, 2.4rpg, 14.4apg, 1.8spg
against san antonio: 9.8ppg, 4.3rpg, 11.7apg, 1.3spg (no homecourt advantage)

stockton was also his teams best player in the elimination game 7 against seattle, leading the jazz in points, rebounds, assists, and steals.
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The Sixers lost in game 1, but Barkley with a sprained ankle had 21 points, 13 rebounds and 6 blocks on 8/15 shooting including the steal and basket to tie the game at 104 with 1:10 remaining.

Barkley led the Sixers with 26 points, 15 rebounds and 3 assists on 9/15 shooting an OT game 2 win. He was the hero in OT with 8 points including a key steal and basket to give the Sixers a 121-120 lead, and then the gamewinner with 11 seconds left.

In game 3, Barkley had 39 points to go along with 9 rebounds on 13/19 shooting and 13/14 from the line, though he did miss a key free throw.

In game 4, Barkley had 25 points, 13 rebounds and 4 assists on 8/10 shooting including 12 points in the 4th quarter.

Though he did have just 12 points and 13 rebounds and 5/19 shooting in game 5. Regardless, it was much better than those Stockton series, and Charles was just a 3rd year player and his play through 4 games was a reason they had a chance to beat a superior opponent.

beside points and blocks, barkley decreased in every way. his assists and steals were more than halved, and his rebounding was decreased by 2 per game, along with the drop in field goal percent.

and then, as you mentioned, was his no show for the elimination game.

the main reason they had a chance to beat a superior opponent was because the players around barkley stepped up more.

roy hinson went from 14/6/1/1/2 48% to 17/5/1/1/2 60%fg
julius erving went from 17/4/3/1/2 to 18/5/3/1/1
and mo cheeks went from 16/3/8/3/0 to 18/3/9/2/1
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In game 1, he didn't dominate thanks to Oakley's physical defense and Knick double teams, but he did still have 22 points, 12 rebounds and 6 assists on 7/12 shooting.

In game 2, Barkley had 30 points, 12 rebounds and 7 assists on 10/17 shooting and 10/11 from the line, though the Knicks did make a comeback, and won by 1 point on a 3 by Trent Tucker.

In game 3, Barkley had 29 points, 11 rebounds and 3 assists on 12/16 shooting, but they lost by 1 in OT on a gamewinner by Gerald Wilkins with 6 seconds remaining.

They had a chance to win the series, but Barkley's play was a reason they competed with a superior team in all 3 games that were decided late in the games.
they got swept in the first round. barkley, again, was nowhere near where the sixers needed him to be, and he was outplayed by maurice cheeks, who showed how a star player should step up in times of crisis.

cheeks averaged 17.7ppg, 3.7rpg, 13.0apg, 2.3spg, and only 1.0to per game.

ron anderson also stepped up more than barkley, averaging 20.7ppg, 5.3rpg, and 4.3apg.
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I'd agree more with criticizing Barkley's play in '94 and '95 because he at least had contending teams and was closer to his prime, despite dealing with injuries.
atleast they made it past the first round in '94, and '95
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Barkley played fine, that said, he was 34 by this time with bad knees and a bad back. No longer a dominant force and no longer the franchise player on his team so I didn't really care what he did.
still a top 2 power forward and one of the best 12 players on the planet.
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He was done by this point.
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Barkley stepped up a lot.

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Not really, I chose '02 Kidd in a recent thread over '11 Derrick Rose. In fact, Kidd was the best PG in the league from '99-'04 with the exception of '00.
thats funny, considering i have rose over kidd in that argument. gary payton was the best point guard in '99, '00, and '01. it was kidd from '02-'04, and '07.
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Rondo was a fine player, and he was the standout player of the Cavs series, but Pierce was probably still the man on that team, and the standout player of the ECF vs Orlando, and would have probably been finals MVP had Boston won. Rondo only really stood out in the ECSF.

Top 5 players are at a different level. The Celtics won because of the strength of their whole team, which was 8 deep with quality players, and their team defense.
pierce wasn't even top 2 on the celtics roster. no way pierce wins finals mvp with his 18/5/3 on 44%fg, especially when rondo is getting 14/6/8/2, including a nice 19/12/10/2 triple double in their game 2 win. kg also probably outplayed pierce in the finals.
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