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Old 08-11-2012, 04:33 AM   #163
Decent college freshman
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 2,572
Default Re: Barkley: I'm better than Malone

Considering what he did against Buck Williams, it's definitely up there. I never said his '92 WCF was his best series for sure, just that it's one of his best.

Malone was anywhere from a top 2-4 player, and Barkley never got outplayed by Mo Cheeks except for his rookie year.
malone had better series in the previous two rounds and he was 8th best in the league.

barkley was ouplayed by cheeks in the 1989 playoffs.
Yeah, that is quite a joke you told.

Ah, the benefits of being a sidekick.
actually, he was the best player on a team that made the conference finals
Malone was always better than him.
stockton was better from '88 til '92.
If you lose in an earlier round, but play at your usual level, it usually means you came to play, but aren't on a contending team. To me, that is not a playoff failure. But in Stockton's case, he was on a contending team, didn't come to play in the series he got eliminated in, and that is a playoff failure to me. I wasn't overly impressed with his play up to that point either.
to me to get eliminated in the first round of the playoffs and not step up to where your team needs you to, to be in a winning position as a superstar player, and get outplayed and step up less than lesser players is a failure to me.
contending teams are contending teams because of individual performances.
Barkley doesn't get outplayed by role players.
Key word, second best player. Barkley didn't have that luxury other than his rookie year and his real decline years in Houston.
what luxury?
Malone had clearly been Utah's best player for a while.
only from 1993, so malone had been the jazz' best player for only 3 years
Nah, they were relatively close, but Penny's offense was significantly better, imo. Payton was clearly the better defender and the gap in their defense was bigger than offense, but offense is more important at the point guard position. Penny finished 3rd in MVP voting, and led the team to a 20-8 record without Shaq, including a 17-5 start when he was averaging 26.4 ppg, 5.3 rpg, 6.8 apg, 2 spg, 50.3 FG%, 62.2 TS% showing what he could do as the man.

Payton's defense was clearly better as I mentioned, both help/team defense and man to man defense. But Penny's passing and court vision impressed me more, his mid-range game was better, imo and he was much bigger and much more athletic making him a greater threat driving to the basket and finishing. Just the better overall scorer and passer/playmaker to me.
penny was a superstar and only 1 spot separated these two on the official '96 rankings.

hardaway was the second best player on a team that had the second best record in the east and got swept in the conference finals.

payton was the best player on a team that had the second best record in the league and lost in the nba finals, the sonics also won 2 games against the bulls in the finals - 1 more than the three teams combined managed before seattle played them, and swept the defending 2 time champion houston rockets in the second round.

payton also was the defensive player of the year, more valuable, and led the league in steals per game, making it an easy decision.
Yes, and I don't care for the reason I already stated.
its ok that you don't care, as long as you agree
Barkley's series was impressive to me, especially for a 3rd year player. It doesn't alter his ranking on my list one way or the other, though.
how many years a player has played doesn't come into consideration when ranking players for me. barkley decreasing his production on many different categories does matter, especially when he is losing in the first round and others around him are stepping up - guys like roy hinson, julius erving, and mo cheeks. and barkley's ranking dropped from 5th after the regular season, to 8th after the playoffs because of this.
Nice imagination.

I don't know where you get this shit from. I don't think you're being serious.
i haven't thought you were serious since your first post in this thread
Kobe not in the top 18? Again, you can't be serious. He was the consensus best player. Not only were his individual feats among the greatest ever, but his team overachieved considering their very limited talent level and the injuries to key players.

There was a total of 1 player who had a case to be over Kobe, and that was Tim Duncan. Everyone else was at least 1 tier below.
kobe had a nice regular season, but he simply did not win enought to be ranked anywhere near the top of the league. he also had a trash playoff series, and was destroyed by a suns outfit who had a top 3 paced offense and was almost outplayed by lamar odom, who stepped up alot more than bryant did.
Nash was top 3, would have been top 4 if Dirk hadn't choked so bad in the first round.

Parker was a nice player, but just top 25
dirk's drop off in the post season wasn't enough for nash to surpass him. nowitzki was still in the top 5. also better than nash were tim duncan, lebron james, tracy mcgrady, jason kidd, and kevin garnett.

parker was top 11 overall
Nothing I've said is the least bit surprising, or any sort of stretch. Kidd being top 10 in 2011 and closer to Nowitzki than he was to Chandler or Terry just sounds like a joke or trolling.

Kidd was comparable to Marion as their 4th/5th best player. He was pretty much a role player by that point. A very good one, but role players don't come close to top 10, or top 20 for that matter.
kidd was actually top 9 in 2011. the mavs had alot of one dimentional players but kidd wasn't one of them. in the regular season he was 6th in points, fifth in rebounds, had twice the amount of assists than the next best player, first in steals, fifth in blocks, and only turned the ball over 2 times per contest in 33 minutes, and had a 3.73/1 assist to turnover ratio, which was third among all players in the regular season.

in the playoffs he was fourth in points, fourth in rebounts, over two times the amount of assists than the next best player, first in steals, fifth in blocks, and only recorded 2.6 turnovers per game which is a very low number for a point guard, and had a 2.73/1 assist to turnover ratio, which was third among all players in the playoffs.
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