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-   -   Kevin Durant vs George Gervin (http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=184893)

ShaqAttack3234 07-24-2010 10:52 PM

Kevin Durant vs George Gervin
 
What do you think? Is Durant already as good as Gervin ever was, is he better, or is he still a bit below prime George Gervin?

Durant is already a better rebounder, but Gervin is one of the greatest scorers of all time. I've watched some prime George Gervin games for the first time and he really was impressive. Didn't seem to hog the ball, was efficient, had good shot selection, excellent mid-range and turnaround jumper, very smooth getting to the basket and a creative scorer. However Gervin was known as a poor defender even though he was a very good shot blocker for his position. While Durant is not an all-defense level player, I've seen him shown some potential as far as 1 on 1 defense. But only flashes of it like that 4th quarter in the playoffs where he shut down Kobe. One thing that will be key is whether Durant proves to be clutch or not, Gervin wasn't known as particularly clutch so that is what could potentially make Durant better, though he has yet to prove himself as clutch.

This is a much better comparison for Durant IMO, than Jordan, Kobe, Lebron, Wade or prime T-Mac. Those guys are/were excellent passers/playmakers. That's not really Durant's game.

But I haven't watched enough George Gervin games to really decide. For those that have seen more George Gervin games or watched him in his prime, what's your opinion?

And before Joyner comes in slamming Gervin and sucking Durant's dick, here are the stats because that's what Joyner bases his entire argument around.

George's scoring title seasons.
1978- 27.2 ppg, 5.1 rpg, 3.7 apg, 1.7 spg, 1.3 bpg, 3.7 TO, 53.6 FG%, 83 FT%, 59.4 TS%
1979- 29.6 ppg, 5 rpg, 2.7 apg, 1.7 spg, 1.1 bpg, 3.6 TO, 54.1 FG%, 82.6 FT%, 59.1 TS%
1980- 33.1 ppg, 5.2 rpg, 2.6 apg, 1.4 spg, 1 bpg, 3.3 TO, 52.8 FG%, 85.2 FT%, 58.7 TS%
1982- 32.3 ppg, 5 rpg, 2.4 apg, 1 spg, 0.6 bpg, 2.7 TO, 50 FG%, 86.4 FT%, 56,.2 TS%

Durant's scoring title season
30.3 ppg, 7.6 rpg, 2.8 apg, 1.4 spg, 1 bpg, 3.3 TO, 47.6 FG%, 90 FT%, 60.7 TS%

jlauber 07-24-2010 10:56 PM

Re: Kevin Durant vs George Gervin
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by ShaqAttack3234
What do you think? Is Durant already as good as Gervin ever was, is he better, or is he still a bit below prime George Gervin?

Durant is already a better rebounder, but Gervin is one of the greatest scorers of all time. I've watched some prime George Gervin games for the first time and he really was impressive. Didn't seem to hog the ball, was efficient, had good shot selection, excellent mid-range and turnaround jumper, very smooth getting to the basket and a creative scorer. However Gervin was known as a poor defender even though he was a very good shot blocker for his position. While Durant is not an all-defense level player, I've seen him shown some potential as far as 1 on 1 defense. But only flashes of it like that 4th quarter in the playoffs where he shut down Kobe. One thing that will be key is whether Durant proves to be clutch or not, Gervin wasn't known as particularly clutch so that is what could potentially make Durant better, though he has yet to prove himself as clutch.

This is a much better comparison for Durant IMO, than Jordan, Kobe, Lebron, Wade or prime T-Mac. Those guys are/were excellent passers/playmakers. That's not really Durant's game.

But I haven't watched enough George Gervin games to really decide. For those that have seen more George Gervin games or watched him in his prime, what's your opinion?

And before Joyner comes in slamming Gervin and sucking Durant's dick, here are the stats because that's what Joyner bases his entire argument around.

George's scoring title seasons.
1978- 27.2 ppg, 5.1 rpg, 3.7 apg, 1.7 spg, 1.3 bpg, 3.7 TO, 53.6 FG%, 83 FT%, 59.4 TS%
1979- 29.6 ppg, 5 rpg, 2.7 apg, 1.7 spg, 1.1 bpg, 3.6 TO, 54.1 FG%, 82.6 FT%, 59.1 TS%
1980- 33.1 ppg, 5.2 rpg, 2.6 apg, 1.4 spg, 1 bpg, 3.3 TO, 52.8 FG%, 85.2 FT%, 58.7 TS%
1982- 32.3 ppg, 5 rpg, 2.4 apg, 1 spg, 0.6 bpg, 2.7 TO, 50 FG%, 86.4 FT%, 56,.2 TS%

Durant's scoring title season
30.3 ppg, 7.6 rpg, 2.8 apg, 3.3 TO, 47.6 FG%, 90 FT%, 60.7 TS%


Gervin was one of the greatest scorers of his era. Durant would have to have some spectacular seasons to come close to being compared with him

.

OnceInADECADE 07-24-2010 10:57 PM

Re: Kevin Durant vs George Gervin
 
nice thread.

I remember when K.D came out of Texas people were calling him the next Iceman.

BTW i never seen Gervin play b4 i wasnt even born

joyner82 07-24-2010 11:01 PM

Re: Kevin Durant vs George Gervin
 
Durant at 21 is/was better than prime Gervin and it's not even really close. Durant is a more efficient scorer and a far better defender.

L.Kizzle 07-24-2010 11:01 PM

Re: Kevin Durant vs George Gervin
 
Durant may be a slightly more athletic Alex English.

jlauber 07-24-2010 11:02 PM

Re: Kevin Durant vs George Gervin
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by joyner82
Durant at 21 is/was better than prime Gervin and it's not even really close. Durant is a more efficient scorer and a far better defender.


Durant MAY be a better scorer...but to say that he was better, at 21, than a PRIME Gervin is simply not true.

jlauber 07-24-2010 11:06 PM

Re: Kevin Durant vs George Gervin
 
How about some post-season comparison's between the two?

joyner82 07-24-2010 11:06 PM

Re: Kevin Durant vs George Gervin
 
Durant's 3rd season vs Gervin's best season
Code:

Player  FG  FGA  FG%  3P 3PA  3P%  FT FTA  FT% ORB DRB TRB AST STL BLK TOV  PF  PTS
Gervin 13.1 24.9 .528 0.4 1.3 .314 6.5 7.6 .852 2.0 3.2 5.2 2.6 1.4 1.0 3.3 2.7 33.1
Durant 9.7 20.3 .476 1.6 4.3 .365 9.2 10.2 .900 1.3 6.3 7.6 2.8 1.4 1.0 3.3 2.1 30.1



Code:

Player PER  TS% eFG% ORB% DRB% TRB% AST% STL% BLK% TOV% USG% ORtg DRtg  OWS  DWS    WS WS/48
Gervin 24.0 .587 .536  5.7  8.9  7.3 11.0  1.6  1.4 10.3 31.7  115  110  9.3  1.3  10.6 0.173
Durant 26.2 .607 .514  3.8 17.9 11.0 13.5  1.8  1.9 11.7 32.0  118  104 11.1 5.0 16.1 0.238


Durant dominates him across the board like I said. The only thing Gervin did more of was shoot.

60.7 TS vs 58.7
26.2 PER vs 24.0 PER
.238 WSp48 vs .173 WSp48

Comparison is a joke

iamgine 07-24-2010 11:09 PM

Re: Kevin Durant vs George Gervin
 
Why Gervin though? Why not Dantley or Bernard King?

jlauber 07-24-2010 11:10 PM

Re: Kevin Durant vs George Gervin
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by joyner82
Durant's 3rd season vs Gervin's best season
Code:

Player  FG  FGA  FG%  3P 3PA  3P%  FT FTA  FT% ORB DRB TRB AST STL BLK TOV  PF  PTS
Gervin 13.1 24.9 .528 0.4 1.3 .314 6.5 7.6 .852 2.0 3.2 5.2 2.6 1.4 1.0 3.3 2.7 33.1
Durant 9.7 20.3 .476 1.6 4.3 .365 9.2 10.2 .900 1.3 6.3 7.6 2.8 1.4 1.0 3.3 2.1 30.1



Code:

Player PER  TS% eFG% ORB% DRB% TRB% AST% STL% BLK% TOV% USG% ORtg DRtg  OWS  DWS    WS WS/48
Gervin 24.0 .587 .536  5.7  8.9  7.3 11.0  1.6  1.4 10.3 31.7  115  110  9.3  1.3  10.6 0.173
Durant 26.2 .607 .514  3.8 17.9 11.0 13.5  1.8  1.9 11.7 32.0  118  104 11.1 5.0 16.1 0.238


Durant dominates him across the board like I said. The only thing Gervin did more of was shoot.

60.7 TS vs 58.7
26.2 PER vs 24.0 PER
.238 WSp48 vs .173 WSp48

Comparison is a joke


How about his ONE post-season with a PRIME Gervin's BEST post-season(s)?

ShaqAttack3234 07-24-2010 11:11 PM

Re: Kevin Durant vs George Gervin
 
:roll: at Durant being more efficient, he has an edge in TS%, but Gervin kills him in FG% which is still a factor because TS% doesn't factor in that misses hurt a team and rewards less consistent streaky/volume scorers. FG% is a good indicator of how consistent a scorer is.

And get that PER garbage out of here.

joyner82 07-24-2010 11:16 PM

Re: Kevin Durant vs George Gervin
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by ShaqAttack3234
:roll: at Durant being more efficient, he has an edge in TS%, but Gervin kills him in FG% which is still a factor because TS% doesn't factor in that misses hurt a team and rewards less consistent streaky/volume scorers. FG% is a good indicator of how consistent a scorer is.

And get that PER garbage out of here.



Missing a free throw is worse than missing a FGA because you have a lesser percentage of getting an offensive rebound off a miss ft than a standard FG. Also Durant destroys him in 3P% and last time I checked a 90% free throw shooter getting to the line is more efficient than anyone on the court taking a shot.

ShaqAttack3234 07-24-2010 11:23 PM

Re: Kevin Durant vs George Gervin
 
A missed FT does NOT hurt a team more than a missed FG because even if you miss a FT you can set your defense and actually that still helps, a missed FG, particularly a long jumpshot, can lead to a fastbreak for the other team and even with a missed FT, you still drew a foul on another player/team.

And yeah, Durant shoots 90%, but Gervin was no slouch in that department, he shot between 82-87% in all of his scoring title seasons. And 3s weren't really part of the game in Gervin's prime.

I posted TS%, but better TS% doesn't equal more efficient and because of Gervin's big advantage in FG%(he shot between 50-55% in his scoring title seasons while Durant shot between 47-48%) plus the fact that Durant didn't average 32-33 ppg either and volume has to be factored in.

At best, you can call their efficiency a wash.

And the Gervin comparison is better than a King or Dantley comparison because those guys posted up more and were were a lot stronger and more physical. I've heard some strange comparisons for Durant like Nowitzki and even more off, Garnett. :roll:

OnceInADECADE 07-24-2010 11:32 PM

Re: Kevin Durant vs George Gervin
 
yea i also remember Dicky V calling K.D. the next K.G. :lol :lol moron

joyner82 07-24-2010 11:34 PM

Re: Kevin Durant vs George Gervin
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by ShaqAttack3234
A missed FT does NOT hurt a team more than a missed FG because even if you miss a FT you can set your defense and actually that still helps, a missed FG, particularly a long jumpshot, can lead to a fastbreak for the other team and even with a missed FT, you still drew a foul on another player/team.

And yeah, Durant shoots 90%, but Gervin was no slouch in that department, he shot between 82-87% in all of his scoring title seasons. And 3s weren't really part of the game in Gervin's prime.

I posted TS%, but better TS% doesn't equal more efficient and because of Gervin's big advantage in FG%(he shot between 50-55% in his scoring title seasons while Durant shot between 47-48%) plus the fact that Durant didn't average 32-33 ppg either and volume has to be factored in.

At best, you can call their efficiency a wash.

And the Gervin comparison is better than a King or Dantley comparison because those guys posted up more and were were a lot stronger and more physical. I've heard some strange comparisons for Durant like Nowitzki and even more off, Garnett. :roll:


Durant at 21 put up 30 a game on 20 shots or

Gervin averaged over 30 twice in his career and needed 25 FGA to get it done.

During the heart of his prime he posted 29.6 ppg and needed 21.9 FGA to get it done. That was his most efficient 28+ ppg season.

Also Gervin played on teams that were always 1st or 2nd in the league in pace/ppg. Durant is on a team that is primarily defensive minded which makes his numbers even more ridiculous.


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