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Old 05-23-2013, 09:54 AM   #1
lakers_forever
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Default Atheists and theists - Do good: we will meet one another - says the Pope.

Beautiful words from Pope Francis.. Peace to all brothers, atheists and theists.


"The Lord created us in His image and likeness, and we are the image of the Lord, and He does good and all of us have this commandment at heart: do good and do not do evil. All of us. ‘But, Father, this is not Catholic! He cannot do good.’ Yes, he can. He must. Not can: must! Because he has this commandment within him. Instead, this ‘closing off’ that imagines that those outside, everyone, cannot do good is a wall that leads to war and also to what some people throughout history have conceived of: killing in the name of God. That we can kill in the name of God. And that, simply, is blasphemy. To say that you can kill in the name of God is blasphemy.”

“Instead,” the Pope continued, “the Lord has created us in His image and likeness, and has given us this commandment in the depths of our heart: do good and do not do evil”:

"The Lord has redeemed all of us, all of us, with the Blood of Christ: all of us, not just Catholics. Everyone! ‘Father, the atheists?’ Even the atheists. Everyone! And this Blood makes us children of God of the first class! We are created children in the likeness of God and the Blood of Christ has redeemed us all! And we all have a duty to do good. And this commandment for everyone to do good, I think, is a beautiful path towards peace. If we, each doing our own part, if we do good to others, if we meet there, doing good, and we go slowly, gently, little by little, we will make that culture of encounter: we need that so much. We must meet one another doing good. ‘But I don’t believe, Father, I am an atheist!’ But do good: we will meet one another there.”


Text from page http://en.radiovaticana.va/news/2013...ace/en1-694445
of the Vatican Radio website
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Old 05-23-2013, 10:08 AM   #2
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Default Re: Atheists and theists - Do good: we will meet one another - says the Pope.

I thought we aren't allowed into heaven, if we did good, but still didn't believe in GOD

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Old 05-23-2013, 10:20 AM   #3
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Default Re: Atheists and theists - Do good: we will meet one another - says the Pope.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Boomerang
I thought we aren't allowed into heaven, if we did good, but still didn't believe in GOD


We aren't, but I prefer this kind of message than the fire and brimstone one to be honest.
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Old 05-23-2013, 10:39 AM   #4
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Default Re: Atheists and theists - Do good: we will meet one another - says the Pope.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaspah
Religion is so fcking stupid.

Religion is for weak minded individuals who can't fathom dying and need some sort of belief to not be terrified of death even though its inevitable for all of us.

I don't belong to any religion, I just live life as a polite man trying to get his own out here. I'm an animal, i will die in the future.

Religion is silly and unbelievable since there's so many of them. All you religious nuts, what do you say about the fact there's 50 other religions that have different beliefs, x amount of gods, and do all kinds of things different than you? You're saying your religion is real and there's isn't? I'm pretty sure they believe there religion is the real one and you're full of it.

Know what I think? You're all full of it. Believe in what you want and let others chive on, you can't keep doing this stupid religion vs religion bullish!t.

You can tolerate other people's beliefs (religious or non-religious), that doesn't mean you think they are exactly as right as your own beliefs. Actually tolerance means the opposite, the generous gesture of accepting the others belief/behaviour despite your thinking it is inferior.
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Old 05-23-2013, 10:41 AM   #5
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Default Re: Atheists and theists - Do good: we will meet one another - says the Pope.

I predict this thread will devolve into dozens of page of religious trolling and incessant talk about near death experiences.
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Old 05-23-2013, 10:45 AM   #6
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Default Re: Atheists and theists - Do good: we will meet one another - says the Pope.

INB4 miller-time skips school to spend a whole day spreading his atheist propaganda.
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Old 05-23-2013, 11:49 AM   #7
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Default Re: Atheists and theists - Do good: we will meet one another - says the Pope.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaspah
Religion is so fcking stupid.

Religion is for weak minded individuals who can't fathom dying and need some sort of belief to not be terrified of death even though its inevitable for all of us.

I don't belong to any religion, I just live life as a polite man trying to get his own out here. I'm an animal, i will die in the future.

Religion is silly and unbelievable since there's so many of them. All you religious nuts, what do you say about the fact there's 50 other religions that have different beliefs, x amount of gods, and do all kinds of things different than you? You're saying your religion is real and there's isn't? I'm pretty sure they believe there religion is the real one and you're full of it.

Know what I think? You're all full of it. Believe in what you want and let others chive on, you can't keep doing this stupid religion vs religion bullish!t.

So you are saying your the same as everyone else who has a religion?

I never understood why atheists have to constantly bash people for having a religion. Do you think I give a shit that you don't believe in anything? To us religious people, your view makes no sense.

Leave your opinion to yourself. If you don't believe in anything thats fine but don't knock people who do.
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Old 05-23-2013, 12:18 PM   #8
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Default Re: Atheists and theists - Do good: we will meet one another - says the Pope.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaspah
I have a right to speak my mind when people advertise religion. This thread isn't what spawned my entire perspective of religion. I think you guys are pathetic.

Catholics. You don't let your priests be with women, and they're constantly in the media spotlight for molesting little boys. That's so fcked up. Know why they're molesting little boys? Because their religion says they can't touch a female.

You think that's sane and normal? Stripping a grown man the right to touch a woman? The fact religious people can get behind these beliefs is what makes me rage. Brainwashed.

All rationale points to the fact that religion is man made and false in the grand scheme of things.

No one is forcing them to do it, that is there choice.

Im not going to argue with you anymore since you think all religious people are pathetic. You clealy have some deep issues with the topic which I don't care to know.
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Old 05-23-2013, 12:44 PM   #9
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Default Re: Atheists and theists - Do good: we will meet one another - says the Pope.

I think religion probably the most dangerous thing the world has ever seen. Nothing makes more otherwise rational people sound and behave like idiots. From nuts flying planes into buildings, crusades for hundreds of years, burning women as witches, self mutilation, killing people to please the sun god, hundreds of servants being buried with a dead king to serve him in the afterlife, idiots protesting at dead soldiers funerals over gay people being...allowed to exist....and on and on and on.

It is flat out dangerous.

People would kill each other no matter what. But as it stands...waaaaaaaaaaaaay too much of it is because of something an old book says.

Just try to live your life and do the right thing.

What you believe is none of my business. But so many faiths instruct followers to make it my business....

Its hard to get away from really. The only way to not see people dying over faith every day is to not watch coverage of world events. Every damn day....some maniac cuts off a soldiers head, blows up a bus full of kids, pretends raped women can prevent getting pregnant through magic, or suggests gay people are subhuman.

Because of a goddamn book. From thousands of years ago.....that at best...is just an attempt to guide people towards doing the right thing.

And there are people who would kill me and my children for saying so.

And then act like im the evil one.

All of it really needs to go away.
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Old 05-23-2013, 12:50 PM   #10
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Default Re: Atheists and theists - Do good: we will meet one another - says the Pope.

More and more younger people are starting to think for themselves logically and realizing religion is bogus.

Unfortunately, there are still many that get brainwashed at the beginning of childhood. If I have kids, I will give them the choice of whether or not they want to partake in religious activities. Unlike my family, who forced me to go to Sunday school and other various things.

As for the comments, it's good that the pope is open-minded. Maybe it'll help some of the close-minded folk.
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Old 05-23-2013, 12:53 PM   #11
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Default Re: Atheists and theists - Do good: we will meet one another - says the Pope.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaspah
Religion is so fcking stupid.

Religion is for weak minded individuals who can't fathom dying and need some sort of belief to not be terrified of death even though its inevitable for all of us.

I don't belong to any religion, I just live life as a polite man trying to get his own out here. I'm an animal, i will die in the future.

Religion is silly and unbelievable since there's so many of them. All you religious nuts, what do you say about the fact there's 50 other religions that have different beliefs, x amount of gods, and do all kinds of things different than you? You're saying your religion is real and there's isn't? I'm pretty sure they believe there religion is the real one and you're full of it.

Know what I think? You're all full of it. Believe in what you want and let others chive on, you can't keep doing this stupid religion vs religion bullish!t.


You want religious people to believe what they want to believe but then you go out of your way to say we're full of it. And then you call us zealots. The Atheist hypocrisy is alive and well in this one.
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Old 05-23-2013, 01:00 PM   #12
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Default Re: Atheists and theists - Do good: we will meet one another - says the Pope.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaspah


There's a fcking religion thread on here daily.



All these threads you see are attacking religion, primarily Christianity.


However, just a week or so ago, there was a thread on whether or not Islam was peaceful. ISH is a funny place. We have people on here that bash the hell out of Christians and God, and then we have people that don't say a word out against Islam.
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Old 05-23-2013, 01:06 PM   #13
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Default Re: Atheists and theists - Do good: we will meet one another - says the Pope.

There are topics against Ialam ALL the time. There were 2-3 this week. The worst of which get deleted because they are way more offensive to muslims than the anti christian ones are to you.
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Old 05-23-2013, 01:44 PM   #14
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Default Re: Atheists and theists - Do good: we will meet one another - says the Pope.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kblaze8855
I think religion probably the most dangerous thing the world has ever seen. Nothing makes more otherwise rational people sound and behave like idiots. From nuts flying planes into buildings, crusades for hundreds of years, burning women as witches, self mutilation, killing people to please the sun god, hundreds of servants being buried with a dead king to serve him in the afterlife, idiots protesting at dead soldiers funerals over gay people being...allowed to exist....and on and on and on.

It is flat out dangerous.

People would kill each other no matter what. But as it stands...waaaaaaaaaaaaay too much of it is because of something an old book says.

Just try to live your life and do the right thing.

What you believe is none of my business. But so many faiths instruct followers to make it my business....

Its hard to get away from really. The only way to not see people dying over faith every day is to not watch coverage of world events. Every damn day....some maniac cuts off a soldiers head, blows up a bus full of kids, pretends raped women can prevent getting pregnant through magic, or suggests gay people are subhuman.

Because of a goddamn book. From thousands of years ago.....that at best...is just an attempt to guide people towards doing the right thing.

And there are people who would kill me and my children for saying so.

And then act like im the evil one.

All of it really needs to go away.

I think you are being very simplistic. Suicide bombing, cruzades, wars, all of that are caused by many things other than religion. For instance, researches show that it's politics, not religion, the main reason for suicide attacks. In the end, even if religion is involved, most conflicts are about land, money and power. If religion disappeared from the face of the world, the Israeli-Palestinian conflict would remain. Also stupid people would be do stupid things no matter what. You see south american killing each other because of soccer. You see criminals killing people son they can have the money to buy stupid things like an IPAD. If not for religion, stupid people would probably just find another bs excuse to do stupid things.

Also, some non believers tend to only focus on the bad side of religion (there are bad things, of course), like saying it takes religion for a bad person to do bad things (maybe that's true). But they did not mention that it likewise takes religion for a bad person to do good things. I've never seen a criminal turns his life around because he found atheism. The AA's of the world exists because of religion.

Some atheists also don't like to mention that several researches show the positive impact of religion in someone's life. For instance, a religious person is less likely to commit suicide, less likely to abuse drugs (and more likery to recover from drug abuse) than atheits. Religion also in general has a positive impact in someone's health*.

Lastly, the charity. Do you even imagine how many poor people are helped by religious orphanages, senior homes, hospitals and schools all around the world? If not for religious institutions, who would take care of them all? Countries all around the word? The same countries that leave 1 billion people living in misery?

Think about the U.S alone. What would happen if the Catholic Church ceased to exist?

Quote:
Almost 7,000 schools would close in the United States alone. Already under-performing public schools suffering from overcrowding would likely collapse under the weight of about 2.6 million children showing up at the door expecting a free education. You think test scores are low now? Wait until 2.6 million more kids show up.

Over 200 Catholic colleges and universities with over 600,000 students would suddenly be without a school, leaving supply diminished and demand unchanged thus skyrocketing the already exorbitant cost of college.

The over 200 Catholic residential homes for children, or orphanages, which serve 50,000 children in a given year would be gone. The children would be shuttled into already crammed government programs or lost completely.

The over 84 million people who receive care at any of about 600 Catholic hospitals every year would be forced to seek help elsewhere, clogging up hospitals. The more than 15 million emergency room visits per year to Catholic hospitals would be headed to other hospitals already suffering from financial losses of emergency rooms. Emergency vehicles would also have increased travel times, driving up fatality rates.

The Catholic health care network, which also includes over 400 health care centers and over 1,500 specialized homes, would shut down. Many assisted living facilities, adult day care and senior housing would be gone.

Many crisis pregnancy centers would vanish, leaving women without options or help when they need it most.

Many homes for pregnant women or abused women would disappear, forcing women to the streets or a return to a perhaps abusive relationship from which they sought escape.

Nearly 70% of U.S. dioceses sponsor housing or housing-related services. That would stop, and homeless numbers would rise.

Over 135 national and hundreds more local Catholic lay organizations that serve the Church and provide services in communities throughout the United States like the Knights of Columbus and the Society of St. Vincent de Paul would disappear. To get an idea, in a given year, the K of C donated $139,711,619 to charity and volunteered 64,039,706 hours. All of that would be gone. The Society of St. Vincent de Paul has about 120,000 members serving 15 million people per year, which include 646,820 home visits, 360,596 hospital visits, 361,420 aged daycare visits, 159,257 prison visits, and $392 million in total expenditures and volunteer services. All gone.

The Catholic Church and organizations supported by the Catholic Church are the largest care providers of HIV and AIDS in the world. All of that would be gone.

The Catholic Campaign for Human Development, which has granted hundreds of millions to thousands of community-based, self-help projects initiated and led by people living in poverty, would cease all grants, leading to the destruction of programs aimed to help the poor.

Catholic Relief Services spends millions to help provide clean water, improve agriculture, and educate the young in countries with little access to any of it. But that too would all be gone along with programs that deliver mosquito nets to prevent malaria in Africa, without which thousands more would likely die needlessly of malaria.

Catholic Charities—which alone is the fourth largest charity in the United States, above the Red Cross and the Salvation Army, and consists of 1,400 agencies that run soup kitchens, temporary shelters, child care, and refugee resettlement all around the country and provides help for 6.5 million people, regardless of religious, social, or economic backgrounds—would be gone.

Read more: http://www.ncregister.com/blog/matth...#ixzz2U8eKaEGT

Now, imagine it in a poor country and all religious institutions, not only the Catholic Church... Not a pretty sight. I've been to cities in South America where the Church is the only help available to the poor people.

So, let's be fair. Religion has some major problems, but let's not pretend the world would be magically be a better place without it (Mao and Stalin's regimes can be seen as examples of a f****d up place without religion). And this thread was to show that yes, we believers and non believers can leave in peace and respect eachother's views. It's sad to see that some religious and atheists can't do that.








*
Quote:
Originally Posted by lakers_forever
Sure.

Religious affiliation and suicide attempt: http://ajp.psychiatryonline.org/arti...ticleid=177228

Religious Aspects of Substance Abuse and Recovery (more substance abuse among atheists): http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/1...324.x/abstract

Religion linked to happy life:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/7302609.stm

Very Religious Americans Lead Healthier Lives
http://www.gallup.com/poll/145379/Re...ier-Lives.aspx

Harvard Professor study says religious people are better citizens and neighbors:

http://www.pewforum.org/Religion-New...tudy-says.aspx

http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/news/...umn15_ST_N.htm


Impact of religion on health.



http://psycnet.apa.org/journals/amp/58/1/53/
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12008795
http://heb.sagepub.com/content/25/6/700.abstract
http://linkinghub.elsevier.com/retri...90?via=sd&cc=y


Off course all this does not imply that religion is true, it might be just a placebo effect. But still it does show that religion has a lot of positive effects and a world without religion might be worse.

Last edited by lakers_forever : 05-23-2013 at 01:53 PM.
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Old 05-23-2013, 01:50 PM   #15
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Default Re: Atheists and theists - Do good: we will meet one another - says the Pope.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kblaze8855
I think religion probably the most dangerous thing the world has ever seen. Nothing makes more otherwise rational people sound and behave like idiots. From nuts flying planes into buildings, crusades for hundreds of years, burning women as witches, self mutilation, killing people to please the sun god, hundreds of servants being buried with a dead king to serve him in the afterlife, idiots protesting at dead soldiers funerals over gay people being...allowed to exist....and on and on and on.

It is flat out dangerous.

People would kill each other no matter what. But as it stands...waaaaaaaaaaaaay too much of it is because of something an old book says.

Just try to live your life and do the right thing.

What you believe is none of my business. But so many faiths instruct followers to make it my business....

Its hard to get away from really. The only way to not see people dying over faith every day is to not watch coverage of world events. Every damn day....some maniac cuts off a soldiers head, blows up a bus full of kids, pretends raped women can prevent getting pregnant through magic, or suggests gay people are subhuman.

Because of a goddamn book. From thousands of years ago.....that at best...is just an attempt to guide people towards doing the right thing.

And there are people who would kill me and my children for saying so.

And then act like im the evil one.

All of it really needs to go away.

You could have just stopped there and you would have made a better point.
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