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dd24 01-17-2011 03:35 PM

Tay Needs To Be Traded Too....
The more I keep reading about everything going on with the Pistons and the more I see how frustrated Tay is. He will be leaving us this off season. We should already be shedding enough payroll if the Hamilton trade goes through to resign Stuckey and maybe even McGrady. I think we need to also be looking to get something for Tay since he's going to walk. Detroit isn't a contender right now so it's not the best for attracting free agents. If we can pull off a trade with him too, even for more draft picks, I say do it.

Kombo 01-17-2011 03:41 PM

Re: Tay Needs To Be Traded Too....
I think we'll only move Prince if we can unload another bad contract at the same time. For example, Prince & Maxiell for Butler & Stevenson.

With that move, that leaves our only two bad contracts: Ben Gordon and Villanueva, who have a little time left to prove themselves.

I don't see us getting much young talent, or borderline allstar level talent for Prince's expiring contract. There isn't nearly the desire to shed bloat like there was leading into last summers FA extravaganza.

dd24 01-17-2011 04:28 PM

Re: Tay Needs To Be Traded Too....
I don't see us getting near all-star level talent either. That's why I'd prefer to see some draft picks. If we could get a 1st rounder for Prince (which I believe he's worth) it would at least be something we could gamble on for the future. I'm sure he'd be heading to a team that would be in the playoffs so the pick could be in the 20's which I'm fine with. Joe D has proven he's better at drafting later anyhow. With a draft pick their pay won't be much either so we could possibly shed some more payroll too, if we get an expirer in return.

dd24 01-17-2011 06:27 PM

Re: Tay Needs To Be Traded Too....
I just found this too.....


Tayshaun Prince calls what is happening to his Pistons team “buffoonery.’’ The Mavs are calling it an “opportunity’’ and has learned the Mavs have let Detroit know of their interest in Prince should the in-turmoil franchise shift into fire-sale mode.

Kombo 01-17-2011 07:23 PM

Re: Tay Needs To Be Traded Too....
I really think Tayshaun would be a great fit in Dallas. Butler + 1st for Prince I think would be fair for both teams. I still think you have to make the move after the Melo/Hamilton trade though, or else NJ will demand we give up Dallas' pick to Denver for taking on Rip's salary.

dd24 01-17-2011 08:46 PM

Re: Tay Needs To Be Traded Too....
I'd be happy with Butler and a 1st.

Nastradamus 01-18-2011 06:46 PM

Re: Tay Needs To Be Traded Too....
I don't think they'd do something like that in Dallas. We could probably use Tay's contract to pick up a longer term contract like Iguodala or Kaman, but I don't see us getting a draft pick for him.

Also worth considering. If we are dealing Rip, we should probably hold on to Tay in order to take full advantage of the expiring deal we'd get for Rip. If only one of thsoe 2 comes off the books, we have limited room. If both come off, we can sign whoever we please, like Randolph.

dd24 01-18-2011 07:13 PM

Re: Tay Needs To Be Traded Too....

Originally Posted by Nastradamus
I don't think they'd do something like that in Dallas. We could probably use Tay's contract to pick up a longer term contract like Iguodala or Kaman, but I don't see us getting a draft pick for him.

Also worth considering. If we are dealing Rip, we should probably hold on to Tay in order to take full advantage of the expiring deal we'd get for Rip. If only one of thsoe 2 comes off the books, we have limited room. If both come off, we can sign whoever we please, like Randolph.

We need our 1st round picks. I think we need more too and I think teams we could potentially trade with will want to trade them. Think about it, most of those teams are over the cap. A 1st round pick means you just gave someone a guaranteed contract. That's why teams like the Lakers are typically trying to trade their first rounders. A team like Dallas would do the same thing. They'd be one of the favorites with Tay. That could be enough to put them right there with the Lakers. They would be extremely deep at that point.

I don't really like the FA class this year. There's one guy who I've mentioned a couple of times and that's Tyson Chandler. I'm not sure Dallas will just let him walk though. At this point in his career he might like playing for a contender, but he probably also wants one last big contract. Detroit is also going to need to resign Stuckey and Jerebko. They'll also need to make a decision about Wilcox (now starting....), Prince, McGrady, and Summers. Anyway around it they aren't going to have a ton of cap space. Yao Ming will be available but that's a huge gamble. Some team is going to try it out though. Who knows, maybe he'll have to take the MLE. Greg Oden will be restricted. He might be worth trying to pay a little bit. If he could stay healthy he might play well with Monroe. Other than that there's just not a lot that excites me about this FA class. I've always liked Randolph but another PF isn't the answer to this team. I think the best way to build is to try to go after one of those C's and keep working the draft for young talent.

Nastradamus 01-21-2011 02:42 PM

Re: Tay Needs To Be Traded Too....
Eh, I disagree with the statement "we need our first rounder draft picks". They are nice, at times, but I'd throw one in to a deal in a heartbeat. Its MUCH more important to move Rip. Gordon can actually play like he is supposed to play with Rip gone and STuckey, as mentioned in another thread, is straight balling as a 2 guard.

I'm a big Randolph fan, not sure what the whole, we don't need another PF thing means. PF is pretty obviously the biggest need on this team. Monroe may play some time there, but he hasn't logged a minute there yet. He's a C, though he will probably be teamed with a bigger, shotblocking type, hence playing 10-15 minutes at the 4. Charlie or Jerebko could play the rest of the minutes, but ot me, this team needs a post scorer. I want Randolph badly for this reason. He's also an elite rebounder and at least as far as being a basketball player, he has matured a ton. He became a leader for the Grizzlies and is a better defender than he ever was previously.

I also like Perkins as a guy to pick up next year. He'd be awesome for us IMO. Chandler is also an option and of course Yao and Oden, the big gamble types. Dallas may not pay Chandler given how much they gave Haywood

We could also use our cap space to make a trade though, for a guy with a big contract, like NJ with Melo or even more so,Utah with Jefferson.

dd24 01-21-2011 04:00 PM

Re: Tay Needs To Be Traded Too....
Sure I'd package a first rounder for the right guy but I don't want to have a fire sale and give Rip and a first rounder away for a guy like Troy Murphy..... Any team rebuilding needs to do a good job drafting. Look at how a team like Oklahoma City built themselves. It was all through the draft. You can't just throw big time money at a bunch of FA's. You have to get those young guys who can potentially lead teams and be on a rookie contract too.

I know Monroe has been starting at C but I think we all agree he is more of a PF. He seems like a Pau Gasol like player who can play either position but is better suited for the 4 position. We have all kinds of guys who can play PF.... Daye, Maxiell, Charlie, Monroe, and definitely don't forget about Jerebko when he comes back from injury. That's not to say Randolph isn't a better player. I'm just saying the money is better spent on another position, depending on where we end up in the draft and who we can get. I really think a guy like Tyson Chandler down low with Monroe would make us a very good team really quick. He's a guy who blocks shots, grabs rebounds, and plays defense. He's always seemed like he would just fit in well in Detroit to me. Another guy who's doing the same right now is DeAndre Jordan. He's a restricted FA and someone might be able to offer him more than the Clippers are willing to. It wouldn't make sense to me for them to have him and Kaman. Of course trading Tay for Kaman is an option too. Anyway around it, I think pairing Monroe with a true C would be what's best for this team. To have a front line much like the Lakers have and then have guys like Jerebko and Daye to back them up would make this a dangerous team.

When considering the FA market the other thing to keep in mind is we aren't one of the teams who are projected to have a lot of money. Here's the list of teams with the lowest payroll projected for next season:

Sacramento Kings—$27.6
Indiana Pacers—$34.8
Houston Rockets—$36.2
New Jersey Nets—$36.3
Memphis Grizzlies—$40.8
Minnesota Timberwolves—$41.7
New York Knicks—$42.5
Denver Nuggets—$43.9
Toronto Raptors—$45

As you can see Memphis is one of those teams. I can only imagine they would like to keep their front line of Gasol and Randolph. Zach made 17 million this year I think. He's going to be forced to take a pay cut but I still think he might be priced out of what Detroit can offer. Detroit's projected payroll for next year is around 48 million and that's after Tay's contract drops off.... Keep in mind they will also need to extend Stuckey and Jerebko because they are restricted FA's. So is Summers but they will probably let him test the market. Prince, McGrady, and Wilcox are all unrestricted. Obviously Prince is going to walk. I think Detroit will think very hard about offering McGrady a contract. He has played well for us. Of course he might be able to get the MLE from a contender finally, which might be enticing to him at this point in his career. Point is, even if we traded Rip and had an expiring contract in return it will be very hard for Detroit to sign a top tier FA. They might have 10 million to spend on a FA. We'll have to see what happens with the new CBA too. I think that all makes having not just a first round pick but a lottery pick that much more valueable, even in a weak draft class. Like I said, for a good player I'm all for it. I just don't see that happening and I think C is still our weakest position. All of the elite teams in the NBA have one thing in common and that is they have long, athletic, talented front lines with plenty of depth.

Kombo 01-21-2011 04:03 PM

Re: Tay Needs To Be Traded Too....
Zach Randolph would be a good player if we really were an interior presence away from winning like we were a few years ago. We aren't there anymore. We need a legit 1, and also a front court player that can alter shots whether that's a 4 or 5. Those are the two most sought after "positions" in the league. We'll need to acquire a lot more assets to trade for one of these players, or build through the draft.

I think we're in position to build like Chicago has built their current team. We won't get the first over all, but we'll be able to get solid draft choices for the next 3 years. Then, our expensive contracts will be gone, so we can hit the FA market before we need to extend our rookie deals, like Chicago did with Boozer. The more young talent we can get, the better for the rebuilding. We arn't one player away, we need role players, starters, stars, everything.

John Henson is a 4 that might match up well with Monroe that has a good chance of being available at our pick. He's raw, but he can alter shots and might be a very good player in 2-3 years.

If we acquired more picks, like Dallas', we might be in the running for drafting someone like Brandon Knight, who's stock is falling, or reach a little bit and draft a guy like McCamey. I'd be very happy with McCamey with a late first rounder more than tying ourself to another huge contract. If we can acquire someone like McCamey, who could become a very good back up point guard, simply for trading one expirer for another, I'm all for it.

The bad thing right now for our team is it looks like we're tied to Hamilton until something else comes up again.

dd24 02-01-2011 03:45 PM

Re: Tay Needs To Be Traded Too....

Pistons expected to deal Prince?
Tayshaun Prince has not had his name mentioned in many trade rumors. He’s been the Pistons’ most consistent player, starting every game and producing similar numbers to those of his career averages. To his credit, Tay’s been a mostly-positive influence on his younger teammates, though he has publicly criticized Kuester on multiple occasions this season. His contract expires this summer, and there’s little doubt he will return this offseason for more of this “buffoonery” as he put it. Detroit could use a center or a point guard, but even a draft pick would entice the Pistons to trade Prince before he leaves in the offseason with nothing in return. — Hoops World

Well, this article mentions getting a draft pick too. I've mentioned before it's better than nothing. I think Prince is the most likely to be dealt....

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