Wilt Chamberlian vs. Kobe Bryant

[Yao Ming's Foot]

you gonna answer some questions but not the others? That's the same thing OP is doing

Is there a point coming up?

[32Dayz]

Is there a point coming up?

Are you too dumb to not understand that Peak Shaq is arguably the best player ever?

Not over a Career obviously but just over his Peak.

Your acting like Kobe won as the man on 5 teams while playing with an average all-star and no bench.

Your delusional as f*.

Kobe was in a Pippen role for 3 of his rings and was the 2nd best player on one of his other two ring winning teams.

Are we really supposed to put a player who was the best player on 1 championship team and who clearly isnt a Top 10 alltime playoff performer in the top 10?

Hell no.

[Yao Ming's Foot]

Are you too dumb to not understand that Peak Shaq is arguably the best player ever?

Not over a Career obviously but just over his Peak.

Your acting like Kobe won as the man on 5 teams while playing with an average all-star and no bench.

Your delusional as f*.

Kobe was in a Pippen role for 3 of his rings and was the 2nd best player on one of his other two ring winning teams.

Are we really supposed to put a player who was the best player on 1 championship team and who clearly isnt a Top 10 alltime playoff performer in the top 10?

Hell no.

I'm pretty sure Kobe has already shred the can't win without Shaq label. Did you not get the memo?

[32Dayz]

I'm pretty sure Kobe has already shred the can't win without Shaq label. Did you not get the memo?

He won a Ring in a weak year and against one of the weakest finals teams in recent history (Orlando).
He also won thanks to Gasols defense on Dwight and his own production
(20/10/2 60%FG)

Then he barely won another against Boston thanks mainly to Gasol stepping up and some major clutch moments by various roleplayers.

Just saying its not like he dominated the league without Shaq.

He did win more but with some really stacked teams and he was only the best player on 1 of those 2 teams.

[Yao Ming's Foot]

He won a Ring in a weak year and against one of the weakest finals teams in recent history (Orlando).
He also won thanks to Gasols defense on Dwight and his own production
(20/10/2 60%FG)

Then he barely won another against Boston thanks mainly to Gasol stepping up and some major clutch moments by various roleplayers.

Just saying its not like he dominated the league without Shaq.

He did win more but with some really stacked teams and he was only the best player on 1 of those 2 teams.

The Magic nearly won 60 games.

The Lakers were not historically stacked by any stretch of the imagination.

[LA_Showtime]

He won a Ring in a weak year and against one of the weakest finals teams in recent history (Orlando).
He also won thanks to Gasols defense on Dwight and his own production
(20/10/2 60%FG)

Then he barely won another against Boston thanks mainly to Gasol stepping up and some major clutch moments by various roleplayers.

Just saying its not like he dominated the league without Shaq.

He did win more but with some really stacked teams and he was only the best player on 1 of those 2 teams.

This post is just idiotic. I've said it countless times that the Lakers were lucky to win two championships, but they still won. They got to the Finals THREE years in a row. That's ****ing hard to do, especially when your center is always injured, your play at point guard is spotty, and you have no depth. I wouldn't say he "dominated" the league, but then again, who has?

[32Dayz]

This post is just idiotic. I've said it countless times that the Lakers were lucky to win two championships, but they still won. They got to the Finals THREE years in a row. That's ****ing hard to do, especially when your center is always injured, your play at point guard is spotty, and you have no depth. I wouldn't say he "dominated" the league, but then again, who has?

I wouldn't say they had no depth.

They had always managed to get a mix of some high quality roleplayers who stepped up when needed.

And the Combo of Kobe/Gasol was one of the best in the league + they had Prime Odom coming off the bench.

Those teams are underrated in general.

Even this year they have enough talent to contend despite losing Odom.

[Deuce Bigalow]

did kobe f*ck your mother or something? why are you in EVERY SINGLE thread related to kobe saying the same exact things? aright we get that you dislike him...

its getting repeatitive and pretty pathetic on your part -- if anything im starting to think your a bit obsessed at this point --

ive noticed a nation of kobe haters on this forum, but without a doubt you stand out the most!! --- do you have a life outside of home? any friends you can vent to about your hate for kobe?


damn son!

Lmao
32Dayz gets destroyed by everyone everyday

[La Frescobaldi]

Is there a point coming up?

Did Chamberlain impact the NBA's pace, or was it just coincidence that he showed up and the entire league pace drastically increased?

Did Kobe impact the league to such an extent they had to re-write the entire rulebook? But even when the NBA made up all those new rules to stop him, did Kobe still break 150 records? {P.S. there aren't any rules designed to stop Kobe}

Is Phil Jackson a better coach than Neil Johnston? What about Dolph Schayes or Dick McGuire or Joe Mulaney or Butch Van Breda Kopf? Is he a better coach than them?

Is Robert Horry better in his league than Tom Meschery was in his?

How about Tom Gola? Was he a better playoff performer in his league than........ ANY starter on Kobe's teams?

1959-60 12.6 ppg .412 fg% 10.6 reb 5.6 ast

1960-61 9.7 ppg .206 fg% 12.3 reb 5.0 ast

1961-62 6.3 ppg .271FG% 8.2 reb 2.7 ast

************************************************** *
What about Lamar Odom ? Is he a better 6th man his league than Billy Cunningham was in '68 when he broke his arm in 3 places in the playoffs?

Is Elgin Baylor's 1970 and '71 playoff record better than Pau Gasol's 2009 & 2010 playoff record?

Speaking of the '71 playoffs, how did Wilt's star teammates Baylor and West perform? {P.S. they both drew DNP}

If you don't see the point then, no, i guess not.

[ThaRegul8r]

Note on rebounding: Wilt's and Russell's rebounding rates for most of their seasons are at around 20-21 throughout their whole careers (slightly higher in the playoffs). Rodman's are higher, but, completely unlike these two, Rodman contested almost zero shots, especially late in his career and in set game situations. If Wilt and Russell had 6-8 bpg seasons, imagine how many shots they contested. Take away their defensive efforts in the air and convert them into rebounding efforts, and their rates would jump up.

Here's some food for thought:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h8-R3bBmhqU

This is Mutombo's 1994 First round series against the Sonics. He blocked 31 shots in 5 games, a Wilt/Russell-like figure. He retained possession of the ball (def.rebound) after only 4 of them (12.9% recuperation rate). His defensive rebounding rate that season was at 25.8, and it would be significantly higher if he didn't care about blocked shots - his blocks were 49% as many as his defensive rebounds! Rodman, in his rebounding prime, usually blocked less than 5% as many shots as the defensive rebounds he grabbed. Do the math. These great shot blockers are all better rebounders than what their rebounding rates show.

I've posted about this elsewhere. As of the 2010-11 season (when I posted this), in the seasons in which we have the data, there have been 72 seasons in which a player has grabbed 20% of all available rebounds. Of those 72 occurrences, only eight times (11.1%) has a player actually blocked over three shots a game:

[QUOTE=ThaRegul8r]The highest single-season block percentages belong to Manute Bol, who was an anemic rebounder. On the career list, the best combination of shot-blocking and rebounding is Dikembe Mutombo, who blocked 6.28 percent of all available shots, and grabbed 19.1 percent of all available rebounds. Looking at the top single seasons:

1. Dennis Rodman* 29.73 1994-95 SAS
2. Dennis Rodman* 26.56 1995-96 CHI
3. Dennis Rodman* 26.19 1991-92 DET
4. Dennis Rodman* 25.99 1992-93 DET
5. Dennis Rodman* 25.74 1993-94 SAS
6. Dennis Rodman* 25.61 1996-97 CHI
7. Dennis Rodman* 24.08 1997-98 CHI
8. Jayson Williams 23.78 1995-96 NJN
9. Danny Fortson 23.70 1998-99 DEN
10. Kevin Love 23.63 2010-11 MIN

Not a single shotblocker to be found. Let

[bizil]

When u put up the numbers Wilt did AND revolutionize the sport, it's VERY HARD to pass up Wilt. Kobe's has sick numbers, a ton rings, etc. But Kobe didn't revolutionize the SG spot. Wilt has those two things on his side like a Magic, Bird, MJ, and Kareem. All five of these guys revolutionized their positions. Even Duncan, KG, and Dirk did it at the same time for the PF position. Kobe was so similar to MJ that u can't out MJ MJ! lol

However if Kobe keeps padding that resume, who knows how far he will go up the GOAT charts. But guys like MJ, Russell, Wilt, Kareem, Bird, and Magic are MYTHIC type figures. It's like Ali and Ray Robinson in boxing. Or baseball wise it's like Ruth, Mays, Ted Williams, or Aaron. Some guys have a certain mystique that keeps them at the top even if certain guys resumes may be better. It seems Kobe maybe in that boat. We shall see!

[Deuce Bigalow]

La Fres...

Wilt was a second option in '69 when Jerry West averaged 38 PPG in the '69 Finals and had 42 points, 13 rebounds, and 12 assists in game 7
not only that, Elgin Baylor was on the team too (top 20 player alltime)
And they DIDN'T win the championship

[RRR3]

La Fres...

Wilt was a second option in '69 when Jerry West averaged 38 PPG in the '69 Finals and had 42 points, 13 rebounds, and 12 assists in game 7
not only that, Elgin Baylor was on the team too (top 20 player alltime)
And they DIDN'T win the championship

Wilt>>>Kobe. Deal with it, Poop Bigego

[Deuce Bigalow]

Wilt>>>Kobe. Deal with it, Poop Bigego

Go watch some Tmac playoff highlights fool

and according to Sam Jones (teammate of Bill Russell during 50's/60's, won 10 rings) Kobe is 3rd best player ever

[Doctor Rivers]

Are you too dumb to not understand that Peak Shaq is arguably the best player ever?

Not over a Career obviously but just over his Peak.

Your acting like Kobe won as the man on 5 teams while playing with an average all-star and no bench.

Your delusional as f*.

Kobe was in a Pippen role for 3 of his rings and was the 2nd best player on one of his other two ring winning teams.

Are we really supposed to put a player who was the best player on 1 championship team and who clearly isnt a Top 10 alltime playoff performer in the top 10?

Hell no.

Do you consider peak Shaq > any version of Wilt?