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  1. #16
    The Renaissance man bladefd's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Real History of WW2 and how it's remembered

    Quote Originally Posted by John8204 View Post
    Hitler did what every other western country was doing at that time. If you actually studied the war and the German system Hitler did WWII but the Holocaust was handled by the SS under Himmler. Hitler just really wanted to expel the Jews as most of Europe wanted to thanks to the mix of the Rothschilds(decentralized banking) and Marxists(militant communism).

    Also WWII had been going on for a while...Japan was in a constant state of War with China, Taiwan, Korea etc...we even went into the Philippines murdered a million people overthrew the government after they overthrew the Spanish because we wanted economic ties with China.
    Hitler knew the details of what himmler was doing. He ordered heydrich and himmler to put together a plan for the Jewish issue, and they came up with the details (heydrich led the conference). But Hitler then approved the plan so I would not excuse Hitler from the holocaust. Dude knew and approved everything going on in his nation, even if he wasn't always directly involved in the small details.

    Ww2 officially began when Germany rolled into Poland. You could argue that the Japanese attack on China (manchuria?) was the start of ww2, but it's not exactly ww2 without Germany's entrance.
    Last edited by bladefd; 11-29-2023 at 01:35 PM.

  2. #17
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    Default Re: The Real History of WW2 and how it's remembered

    Quote Originally Posted by bladefd View Post
    Hitler knew the details of what himmler was doing. He ordered heydrich and himmler to put together a plan for the Jewish issue, and they came up with the details (heydrich led the conference). But Hitler then approved the plan so I would not excuse Hitler from the holocaust. Dude knew and approved everything going on in his nation, even if he wasn't always directly involved in the small details.

    Ww2 officially began when Germany rolled into Poland. You could argue that the Japanese attack on China (manchuria?) was the start of ww2, but it's not exactly ww2 without Germany's entrance.
    We're never really going to know...Hitler has always been the over simplified option. Interment camps were everywhere including in the US. Part of why the KKK had a third run was because leadership was consolidated in US BUND camps. Heydrich and Borman where the ones who ran the conference which decided on the final solution...though half the victims were Polish. We also had a role in that as Poles who tried to flee to the US were delayed by a policy from the Secretary of State (a known Anti-Semite).

    As for Hitler we do blame him for the Holocaust but we forget the Evian conference of 38 which shock of shockers the US simply refused to send anyone of importance.

  3. #18
    NBA Legend and Hall of Famer Jasper's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Real History of WW2 and how it's remembered

    https://worldpopulationreview.com/co...-world-war-two

    I did not know China had such a high casualty during the war....
    Obviously Hitler wanted the whole side of the planet.
    Similar to Trump wanting the whole west

  4. #19
    The Renaissance man bladefd's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Real History of WW2 and how it's remembered

    Quote Originally Posted by John8204 View Post
    We're never really going to know...Hitler has always been the over simplified option. Interment camps were everywhere including in the US. Part of why the KKK had a third run was because leadership was consolidated in US BUND camps. Heydrich and Borman where the ones who ran the conference which decided on the final solution...though half the victims were Polish. We also had a role in that as Poles who tried to flee to the US were delayed by a policy from the Secretary of State (a known Anti-Semite).

    As for Hitler we do blame him for the Holocaust but we forget the Evian conference of 38 which shock of shockers the US simply refused to send anyone of importance.
    No conference such as Wannsee conference could have happened without Hitler's approval and direct knowledge. Lots of upper nazi officials attended and heydrich led it. Heydrich was the 3rd most powerful man at the time in nazi Germany. Of course Hitler knew the conference was happening lol.

    No, Japanese internment camps are not the same as extermination camps in Germany.

    Majority of Poland was Jewish people afaik.

    Yes, us could have saved many more jews by letting them into the USA as refugees. That was a huge blunder by the secretary of state. USA had multiple chances to release details on the nazi extermination camps, but they refused to believe the things were really happening. I do have an issue with that.

    Having said that, you are trying way too hard to excuse Hitler from the final solution. Hitler knew what was happening without a doubt, and I don't need some direct evidence to prove that lol. Hitler was a micro-manager, and nothing went on that he didn't know about. Certainly not something as vast as the extermination camps. I blame Hitler, heydrich, himmler, goebbels, all of the nazis for the final solution.

  5. #20
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    Default Re: The Real History of WW2 and how it's remembered

    Not saying Hitler wasn't involved in the Holocaust, but you are pointing out the key part and problem with the Hitler discussion. The guy that actually put out the programs to murder six million people...Himmler basically has gotten away with it.

  6. #21
    NBA Superstar eliteballer's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Real History of WW2 and how it's remembered

    ...everyone knows and everyone has known since the war itself that the Germans first and firemost cared about the Eastern Front. Like 80% of the German military was on the Eastern Front.

    This isn't some grand revelation.

  7. #22
    pronouns - he/haw Nanners's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Real History of WW2 and how it's remembered

    Quote Originally Posted by Atlantis View Post

    Why don't the Soviets talk about the Holocaust when they liberated the camps?
    This is total nonsense... the soviets were the ones who started the discussion about the holocaust - every single "death camp" was liberated by the soviets, while all of the camps liberated by the US and western forces were only work camps.

    Look up the term "holocaust" on google n-gram viewer. In the years immediately following the war the phrase actually became less common for a decade or two, it was not until the late 60s that the word holocaust could be commonly found within US culture.

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