Leave it to an ACTIVE PLAYER to clarify the difference between eras...

[baudkarma]

Can we just....accept that people who grew up or played in an era, for the most part, are gonna defend their territory? And that a player's opinion will either be validated or trivialized accordingly? I'd feel like a jackass walking into a barber shop thinking youtube footage or basketball reference gives me fair license to argue with some 70 year old about Wilt or Oscar. You can call me 'old man in the clouds' ignorant or absolute, but anyone born 20 years ago, your opinion on 80s/90's basketball really means sweet **** all. At least have the humility to realize that not all opinions are informed, and being entitled to one doesn't make it valid.

This. Players of any era tend to think that their time was the most talented. The guys they went up against were better, the rules were tougher, and nobody respects what they went through. I've yet to hear a pro athlete in any sport say "Yeah, todays players are much more talented, the game is more violent, me and my teammates wouldn't stand a chance against these guys."

[TheMan]

nah. wrong buddy.


That's perfectly understandable due to style of play, but still doesn't really change my point. I think today's base level players are better. And for the record those guys aren't base level, they're starting caibur in that era.


Would you like to specify which rules are Euro influenced? Because as I remember Kobe once said the European game was rougher than our game.....

Huh, wtf

I don't know how the Euroleague is today but it was common knowledge in the 90s that it was a softer league...that was the main concern about Toni Kukoc's transition from the EL to the NBA, that the NBA was much more physical, and yes, he struggled mightily against the Masons and Davis Boys

[Phoenix]

I can dig that, but my point wasn't a referendum on Melo and why his career is done. Just the element of his game that sent him on his way. Again mid range is an important skill for a scorer to possess in his toolbox for all the reasons i already agreed with. But again on a macro scale mid range isn't a tool for ever player. Can we name any end of the bench guys that only have a job because they are money from mid range? If you can name a few I'd be shocked. Because the ideal role player nowdays is 3 and D.....even if he's a big which is insane. The rockets needed Melo to basically be 3 and D and he wasn't really fit for the role. Vince does it as good as any geezer could. Guys trying to make a living won't get contracts shooting midrange with today's philosophy.

I don't think we're far apart on what we're saying. I'm not making the case that the average player necessarily needs to have a mid-range shot, most teams are trying to fill out their benches with those 3 and D guys. I understand that, and I agree.

What I'm referring to, in terms of needing that 'in-between' game, are your upper echelon talents who are driving teams to title contention. Your KDs. Your Kawhis. Your Hardens. Your Currys. Your Greek freaks. Harden's limitations are exposed annually if the 3 isn't falling and the refs go into playoff officiating mode. They're not going to allow him to manipulate the defensive rules into spamming free throws. They want you to make plays to win in the playoffs, not BS the rulebook. The fact that he can't get down and dirty in the midrange and manufacture points that way is why he underperforms in the playoffs( relative to the regular season). Giannis looked poised to take the Bucks to the finals, until the Raptors defense took away his driving lanes and then oh shit, what does he do then? Giannis with a respectable mid-range game would be a damn cheat code. Even worse if he developed a 3pointer. But his athleticism in the mid-range area with some touch out to 18 feet? Ain't a damn human being on earth stopping that. Steph is such a threat from 3 that he's got the defense scrambling, has elite off-ball movement, and he can find his way into an open midrange because he's being run off the line. Every little twitch, eye blink or shoulder fake has the defense committing because of his shooting prowess. But his lack of size means he can't physically impose his will on the game if his 3 is off. That's ultimately why KD has been the finals MVP twice during Golden State's run. He doesn't have a spot. He doesn't have a shot you can take away from him. And when the offense breaks down, what's their first 'we need a fukking basket' option? Isoing KD 18 feet out.

As for Melo, even without a strong 3ball, if he played a lick a defense, if he had some facilitating ability, if he adapted his mentality to accept what he is, he'd be in the league. Melo is still good enough to drop 15 points in 20 mins a night on the opposing teams bench. The biggest problem, like I said, is he still thinks he's a star in this league and while the midrange game has become niche, he doesn't offer anything else but an inflated ego at this point.

[Showtime80']

Vince Carter BARELY played in the 90's, his generation and peak came in the early to mid 2000's and even while he still plays today he can clearly see how SOFT the league has become in the last 20 years and knows the 90's were wayyy more physical.

Here's Steve Kerr, the coach that has won 3 of the last five titles talking about the league altering their rules to suit players like Stephie and Nash before him:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HHoD9UCBgcs

The Europpeans or internationals have ALWAYS been more perimeter oriented going back to Vlade Divac, DIno Radja, Tony Kukoc, Petrovic, Schmidt and even Sabonis had a softer more finness style so part of the NBA's attempt to make the league softer and curtail physicality was to make the league more appealing to those international players who would've been SEVERELY outmatched had they come in with the atmosphere of 80's early 90's.

The NBA now has gotten so soft and perimeter oriented that they have made the Euros look physical by comparison, something that would've been unthinkable 20+ years ago.