Lebron from 2016-2018

[HoopsNY]

MJ with LeBron's cast in 2018 would have been knocked out of the playoffs in the 1st/2nd round.

And we all know MJ is not beating the 2017 Warriors in a 7 game series, not even the '96 Bulls.

Some pretty wild assertions here. Just looking at the 1st round matchups MJ faced:

'96 vs. MIA: 30/4/3/2 on 61% TS%
'97 vs. WAS: 37/6/5/1 on 62% TS%
'98 vs. NJN: 36/5/3/1 on 62% TS%

Kinda strange to think MJ wouldn't at least lead the 2018 Cavs past the 1st round when he was putting up crazy stats in a far slower era.

As for the second round, then why wouldn't he? Love put up 21/12/2/1/1 on 59% TS%. Who's stopping MJ from putting up 35 a night? The Cavs shooters shot 43-94 from 3 (46%) for the series, and they swept Toronto. That wasn't on the back of LeBron alone.

[1987_Lakers]

Some pretty wild assertions here. Just looking at the 1st round matchups MJ faced:

'96 vs. MIA: 30/4/3/2 on 61% TS%
'97 vs. WAS: 37/6/5/1 on 62% TS%
'98 vs. NJN: 36/5/3/1 on 62% TS%

That's cute. LeBron put up 34/10/8 on 66 TS% in the first round that year and barely escaped.

'96-'98 MJ would get stomped.

[tpols]

You can make an argument for a young '88-'93 version of MJ, even though I personally feel he would fall short because LeBron is the greatest floor-raiser ever. But no way '96-'98 MJ could do it with that '18 Cavs cast. LeBron was the better player when both players were in their 30's.

You're acting like the 2018 Cavaliers were trash when they had an elite top 5 ranked offense on the year back then.

And Lebron did have an All Star beside him in Kevin Love and one of the statistically best 3pt shooting casts in the NBA. That isn't bad help.

And then given the competition? Oladipo, Derozan, and teenage Tatum? It just makes your argument for them help being trash even weaker. Trying to make that out to be some heroic gauntlet. What a joke.

MJ would run through that although he would almost certainly lose to Golden State. Probably in 5. Win one home game and lose on the road in the bay.

[1987_Lakers]

You're acting like the 2018 Cavaliers were trash when they an elite top 5 ranked offense on the year back then. And Lebron did have an All Star beside him in Kevin Love and one of the statistically best 3pt shooting casts in the NBA. That isn't bad help.

Revisionist history at its finest. Nobody was propping up LeBron's cast that year.

Only reason why they were top 5 in offense is because of LeBron, the greatest floor raiser ever. How many trades did they make that year because of their struggles? Love was trash for most of the playoffs, LeBron without Love had to come back from being down 3-2 vs Boston in the ECF, you think '96-'98 MJ is doing that with the same circumstances? LOL

[tpols]

How can it be revisionist history when it was a fact?



The 2018 Cavaliers statistically had the 5th best offense, Kevin Love was voted to the All Star team, and they were a very elite 3pt shooting squad 3PA, 3PM, and 3pt%.

What am I revising? That's literally... what happened back then.

[HoopsNY]

That's cute. LeBron put up 34/10/8 on 66 TS% in the first round that year and barely escaped.

'96-'98 MJ would get stomped.

Yea, and it's very likely that MJ's numbers would be similar or better in this mickey mouse era. Furthermore, that wasn't the argument that I was addressing.

I addressed your ridiculous assertion that he'd somehow get knocked out of the 1st round, or better yet, wouldn't beat a Toronto team (that CLE swept) with a sidekick producing 21/12 on 59% TS% or shooters shooting 46% from the distance.

I get you hate MJ and all, but at least be fair.

[1987_Lakers]

How can it be revisionist history when it was a fact?



The 2018 Cavaliers statistically had the 5th best offense, Kevin Love was voted to the All Star team, and they were a very elite 3pt shooting squad.

What am I revising? That's literally... what happened back then.

You propping up the 2018 Cavs like LeBron had a decent cast around him.

In the playoffs

Love: 51 TS%
Jr Smith: 49 TS%
Jeff Green: 52 TS%

You say they were a solid 3 point shooting team, but in the playoffs they shot 33%.

[1987_Lakers]

Yea, and it's very likely that MJ's numbers would be similar or better in this mickey mouse era. Furthermore, that wasn't the argument that I was addressing.

MJ's numbers would be worse considering the NBA didn't have a short 3 point line in 2018 like they did in '96 and '97.

[tpols]

I mean... the 2018 Cavs made the 3rd most 3s in the league that year out of 30 teams. We're trying to give you facts bro. This is all verifiable and I'm surprised you didn't know it. They were dead last in defensive rank. Their offense was their everything.

[tpols]

Yea, and it's very likely that MJ's numbers would be similar or better in this mickey mouse era. Furthermore, that wasn't the argument that I was addressing.

I addressed your ridiculous assertion that he'd somehow get knocked out of the 1st round, or better yet, wouldn't beat a Toronto team (that CLE swept) with a sidekick producing 21/12 on 59% TS% or shooters shooting 46% from the distance.

I get you hate MJ and all, but at least be fair.

That's what I'm saying. If you want to make the debate you have to do it without saying some totally off the rails stuff first.

That version of Lebron was probably almost equal to prime MJ in terms of pure talent and ability imo.

So it's funny to see Lebron stans act like somebody that was as good as him would have no chance of running the Oladipo / Derozan / Tatum gauntlet.

I guess it's just cognitive dissonance.

[Full Court]

We really can't take your post seriously when you say prime MJ would lose to the oladipo Pacers. It invalidates the entire opinion.

I haven't been able to take his posts seriously since he said Tom Brady was the biggest choker in NBA history.

MJ's numbers would be worse considering the NBA didn't have a short 3 point line in 2018 like they did in '96 and '97.

...because MJ racked up sooooooo many of his points by shooting threes.

[HoopsNY]

MJ numbers would be worse considering the NBA didn't have a short 3 point line in 2018 like they did in '96 and '97.

That's assuming his numbers fall off the roof. He shot 42.7% from 3 in 1996 and 37.4% in 1997. Given he shot 35.2% in 1993 (his last season prior to the change), what's he shooting in an era where volume likely increases?

LeBron shot 36.7% in the RS of 2018, and in those first two rounds of the playoffs he shot 28.8% from 3. I fail to see your point here.

LeBron put up 34/9/9 with a 62.5% TS% in those 11 games. If you don't think MJ at least matches that then idk what to tell you. Yea, he might not put up exactly 9 rebs and 9 assists, but a stat line of 36/8/6 on similar TS% is very possible, even likely. And what's even more likely is CLE winning those two rounds.

[1987_Lakers]

I mean... the 2018 Cavs made the 3rd most 3s in the league that year out of 30 teams. We're trying to give you facts bro. This is all verifiable and I'm surprised you didn't know it. They were dead last in defensive rank. Their offense was their everything.

I just gave you facts on what they did in the playoffs, which is what we are discussing.

[1987_Lakers]

LeBron put up 34/9/9 with a 62.5% TS% in those 11 games. If you don't think MJ at least matches that then idk what to tell you. Yea, he might not put up exactly 9 rebs and 9 assists, but a stat line of 36/8/6 on similar TS% is very possible, even likely. And what's even more likely is CLE winning those two rounds.

You think MJ is averaging 8 rpg on similar efficiency? Lmfao

[HoopsNY]

You think MJ is averaging 8 apg and 9 rpg? Lmfao.

Can you read? I said 36/8/6, meaning 8 rebounds and 6 assists. Why's that a shocker? MJ in '97 averaged 8 rebounds for the entirety of the playoffs.

Against CHH, he put up 10.2 rebs in the series. In the ECF, 8.0 rebs. In the finals? 32/7/6. Again, in the slow era. Furthermore, by 2018 we were already in the era of positionless basketball, but for some reason it's outlandish?

Anyway, the main point is the absurdity of claiming he couldn't beat IND and TOR. Quite odd.