Did Donald Trump just have the best day ever for a U.S. President?

[ZenMaster]

Look at the other thread, they made it up by selling to more markets, that was the majority of where they increased their exports, especially to Latin America and India. Keep up.

They didn't start to magically sell more to other markets the moment Trump announced tariffs. They were already in a heavy growth spurt, with March exports being up 12% YoY, that number dropped to 8.1% in April. The fact that China exports can grow this much YoY is another argument for why tariffs are needed btw.

They also didn't increase that number "just by selling to more markets", e.g exports to the EU rose by 8% in the same period and they were already selling to India as well obviously.

[TheMan]

They didn't start to magically sell more to other markets the moment Trump announced tariffs. They were already in a heavy growth spurt, with March exports being up 12% YoY, that number dropped to 8.1% in April. The fact that China exports can grow this much YoY is another argument for why tariffs are needed btw.

They also didn't increase that number "just by selling to more markets", e.g exports to the EU rose by 8% in the same period and they were already selling to India as well obviously.

So what was the point of tariffs again? Better trade deal or bring back US manufacturers

I remember "short term pain, long term pain" but now it's about a better deal with China because Trump idiotically thinks a trade deficit means we're getting ripped off.

Which is it?

[ZenMaster]

So what was the point of tariffs again? Better trade deal or bring back US manufacturers

I remember "short term pain, long term pain" but now it's about a better deal with China because Trump idiotically thinks a trade deficit means we're getting ripped off.

Which is it?

The hell you mean "which is it?" These things are connected..

The tariffs are the trade deals so to speak, they're the essence of those deals and a better trade deal with China means higher tariffs on products exported from China to the US without China putting higher tariffs on products exported from the US into China.

Higher tariffs make the product more expensive for the importer, which makes locally produced products in the US more relevant and thus helps US manufacturing.

[rawimpact]

The hell you mean "which is it?" These things are connected..

The tariffs are the trade deals so to speak, they're the essence of those deals and a better trade deal with China means higher tariffs on products exported from China to the US without China putting higher tariffs on products exported from the US into China.

Higher tariffs make the product more expensive for the importer, which makes locally produced products in the US more relevant and thus helps US manufacturing.

If you have to explain such elementary things to people, one would argue you're just as dumb to even entertain a conversation. Some posters are better ignored IMO. Just saying...

[TheMan]

The hell you mean "which is it?" These things are connected..

The tariffs are the trade deals so to speak, they're the essence of those deals and a better trade deal with China means higher tariffs on products exported from China to the US without China putting higher tariffs on products exported from the US into China.

Higher tariffs make the product more expensive for the importer, which makes locally produced products in the US more relevant and thus helps US manufacturing.

So let's make everything more expensive, right.

That's gonna go over well with the American people

[TheMan]

If you have to explain such elementary things to people, one would argue you're just as dumb to even entertain a conversation. Some posters are better ignored IMO. Just saying...

I bet you were complaining about inflation under Biden.

[diamenz]

The hell you mean "which is it?" These things are connected..

The tariffs are the trade deals so to speak, they're the essence of those deals and a better trade deal with China means higher tariffs on products exported from China to the US without China putting higher tariffs on products exported from the US into China.

Higher tariffs make the product more expensive for the importer, which makes locally produced products in the US more relevant and thus helps US manufacturing.

but the tariffs are off now. we're back at square one in the same place we were before liberation day.
there's no long term strategy. it's all bluster on the part of the trump administration. plus prices are gonna continue to ho up, of which i'm sure i don't have to tell you, will never go back down.

why do you continue to be so optimistic about this without question?

[TheMan]

but the tariffs are off now. we're back at square one in the same place we were before liberation day.
there's no long term strategy. it's all bluster on the part of the trump administration. plus prices are gonna continue to ho up, of which i'm sure i don't have to tell you, will never go back down.

why do you continue to be so optimistic about this without question?

Because he's in a cult, and part of being in a cult is believing Dear Leader can do no wrong.

[1987_Lakers]

but the tariffs are off now. we're back at square one in the same place we were before liberation day.
there's no long term strategy. it's all bluster on the part of the trump administration. plus prices are gonna continue to ho up, of which i'm sure i don't have to tell you, will never go back down.

why do you continue to be so optimistic about this without question?

Not true. Still have a 30% tariff on China

[diamenz]

Not true. Still have a 30% tariff on China

that's 20% is fentanyl and it's not going to last, at all. you've either been fooled or are attempting to fool others. the original china tariffs still stand. nothing has changed.

[ZenMaster]

but the tariffs are off now. we're back at square one in the same place we were before liberation day.
there's no long term strategy. it's all bluster on the part of the trump administration. plus prices are gonna continue to ho up, of which i'm sure i don't have to tell you, will never go back down.

why do you continue to be so optimistic about this without question?

That's just not true at all.

Prior to 2016, average tariffs on China were below 3%. Trump got that number up to around 19% during his first term and it stayed there during Biden. Today, with the terms agreed by China(and what you call back to square one) until they make a permanent deal, the average tariff of Chinese products exported to the US is at 51%, while the same number for China going the other way is 32%(up from 21%).

Vs the rest of the world, the average tariff is almost 12% today, up from 3% prior to the second term of the orange man.

https://www.piie.com/research/piie-c...ffs-date-chart

I'm optimistic because for a lot of businesses it's going to make sense to produce in the US instead, and for the ones where it doesn't they get to pay some tax instead.
You say that's going to make everything even more expensive, but companies will never be able to forward those expenses at a 1:1 ratio and the people most affected by any potential increase in everyday products are also the one's who benefit the most from more middle class jobs.
It's also up to government to lower expenses for the middle and lower class, like lesser taxes. I know it's popular to say that "Trump will give tax breaks and enrich all his rich friends", but let's see what happens and if he's not going to do something to help regular people out - he's certainly currently pissing off any of his buddies importing from China.
He's also trying to deport 20-30 million people, many of whom work at terrible salaries and because of their legal status can only find lower end jobs, helping to bring down the average wage and certainly not helping regular Americans.

[TheMan]

That's just not true at all.

Prior to 2016, average tariffs on China were below 3%. Trump got that number up to around 19% during his first term and it stayed there during Biden. Today, with the terms agreed by China(and what you call back to square one) until they make a permanent deal, the average tariff of Chinese products exported to the US is at 51%, while the same number for China going the other way is 32%(up from 21%).

Vs the rest of the world, the average tariff is almost 12% today, up from 3% prior to the second term of the orange man.

https://www.piie.com/research/piie-c...ffs-date-chart

I'm optimistic because for a lot of businesses it's going to make sense to produce in the US instead, and for the ones where it doesn't they get to pay some tax instead.
You say that's going to make everything even more expensive, but companies will never be able to forward those expenses at a 1:1 ratio and the people most affected by any potential increase in everyday products are also the one's who benefit the most from more middle class jobs.
It's also up to government to lower expenses for the middle and lower class, like lesser taxes. I know it's popular to say that "Trump will give tax breaks and enrich all his rich friends", but let's see what happens and if he's not going to do something to help regular people out - he's certainly currently pissing off any of his buddies importing from China.
He's also trying to deport 20-30 million people, many of whom work at terrible salaries and because of their legal status can only find lower end jobs, helping to bring down the average wage and certainly not helping regular Americans.

When none of which you wrote happens, only the everything is more expensive happens... remember this thread, pal. And the Democrats with complete control of all the levers of power despite their ineptitude...

[diamenz]

That's just not true at all.

Prior to 2016, average tariffs on China were below 3%. Trump got that number up to around 19% during his first term and it stayed there during Biden. Today, with the terms agreed by China(and what you call back to square one) until they make a permanent deal, the average tariff of Chinese products exported to the US is at 51%, while the same number for China going the other way is 32%(up from 21%).

Vs the rest of the world, the average tariff is almost 12% today, up from 3% prior to the second term of the orange man.

https://www.piie.com/research/piie-c...ffs-date-chart

I'm optimistic because for a lot of businesses it's going to make sense to produce in the US instead, and for the ones where it doesn't they get to pay some tax instead.
You say that's going to make everything even more expensive, but companies will never be able to forward those expenses at a 1:1 ratio and the people most affected by any potential increase in everyday products are also the one's who benefit the most from more middle class jobs.
It's also up to government to lower expenses for the middle and lower class, like lesser taxes. I know it's popular to say that "Trump will give tax breaks and enrich all his rich friends", but let's see what happens and if he's not going to do something to help regular people out - he's certainly currently pissing off any of his buddies importing from China.
He's also trying to deport 20-30 million people, many of whom work at terrible salaries and because of their legal status can only find lower end jobs, helping to bring down the average wage and certainly not helping regular Americans.

well you seem far more well versed than i am on this so i'm not even gonna bother arguing at this point. still not on board with all of this but i'm eager to see where it goes.

[ZenMaster]

When none of which you wrote happens, only the everything is more expensive happens... remember this thread, pal. And the Democrats with complete control of all the levers of power despite their ineptitude...

You're right that the establishment might be successful in blocking deportations or not getting through the Trump EO on lower pharma pricing, or maybe Trump won't lower taxes for regular people or pay off national debt, but everything would get more expensive regardless at the very least. Global open border financial politics is designed around a constant increase.

[diamenz]

until they make a permanent deal, the average tariff of Chinese products exported to the US is at 51%, while the same number for China going the other way is 32%(up from 21%).

wait, isn't this % difference what i've been talking about recently? that 20% is the fentanyl tariff, is it not?