I don't think 3ball has actually watched NBA in the 90's

[mehyaM24]

pippen finished top 10 in MOST stat categories, and was top 5 in mvp voting twice. if he was "jr smith" then jordan won in a ****ing awful era.

[3ball]

pippen finished top 10 in MOST stat categories, and was top 5 in mvp voting twice. if he was "jr smith" then jordan won in a ****ing awful era.

Pippen never produced at a higher level than 05' Hughes or Horry in the 95' Finals - that was his caliber and there's zero examples of him playing materially better

Otoh, guys like KJ dominated Magic and Hakeem with premium production, or Worthy had a series of 23 on 72% or was #1 option on b2b champs... Kobe dominated Duncan in 02', or Wade dominated the 11' Finals, while AD led the league in playoff scoring... So everyone enjoyed elite 1st options at sidekick except Jordan, who was stuck with a true 2nd option that produced like 05' Hughes, along with inferior team defenses.

So Pippen doesn't compare to Payton, who was a superior scorer, passer, leader, and led teams to various 1 seeds and even the Finals (where he dominated Pippen and only lost because of MJ)

[hateraid]

Show me where Pippen played anywhere near Worthy's 30 on 62% in the 87' WCF, or X-man's 25/9/4 in that same series

Instead, Pippen only has weak performance by comparison and infact was destroyed by a washed up X-man in 92'

How can a guy be considered great if he never dominated or played on the top level, and infact only played on a weaker level that Horry and JR Smith can reach?

Show me a post where you post anything that doesn't have any stat manipulation or resort to statistics
/Thread

[hateraid]

HEY OP HOWS YOUR BUISNESS GOING? HOWS YOUR HOME EQUITY GOING? HOWS YOUR WIFE AND KIDS GOING? NICE LIFE YIKES

Business is booming. I have plenty of equity. My wife and kids are fine.
I don't get why that's funny. Is smoking crack and living in a motel much more accomplished?

[hateraid]

Pippen never produced at a higher level than 05' Hughes or Horry in the 95' Finals - that was his caliber and there's zero examples of him playing materially better

Otoh, guys like KJ dominated Magic and Hakeem with premium production, or Worthy had a series of 23 on 72% or was #1 option on b2b champs... Kobe dominated Duncan in 02', or Wade dominated the 11' Finals, while AD led the league in playoff scoring... So everyone enjoyed elite 1st options at sidekick except Jordan, who was stuck with a true 2nd option that produced like 05' Hughes, along with inferior team defenses.

So Pippen doesn't compare to Payton, who was a superior scorer, passer, leader, and led teams to various 1 seeds and even the Finals (where he dominated Pippen and only lost because of MJ)

All stats. No context outside of that. Busted

[Ainosterhaspie]

OP: 3ball hasn't actually watched the games, all he knows is stats.

3ball: stats, STATS, STAAAAAATS.

OP: Quod erat demonstrandum.

[mehyaM24]

Pippen never produced at a higher level than 05' Hughes or Horry in the 95' Finals - that was his caliber and there's zero examples of him playing materially better

Otoh, guys like KJ dominated Magic and Hakeem with premium production, or Worthy had a series of 23 on 72% or was #1 option on b2b champs... Kobe dominated Duncan in 02', or Wade dominated the 11' Finals, while AD led the league in playoff scoring... So everyone enjoyed elite 1st options at sidekick except Jordan, who was stuck with a true 2nd option that produced like 05' Hughes, along with inferior team defenses.

So Pippen doesn't compare to Payton, who was a superior scorer, passer, leader, and led teams to various 1 seeds and even the Finals (where he dominated Pippen and only lost because of MJ)

you already posted this in the other thread. neither claim is true though. in pippen's first finals alone, he posted better numbers. played better defense than both of those guys too. comparing pippen to them only laments jordan winning in a poverty era.

during both players primes, payton also produced inferior numbers to pippen. along with that pippen also had more top MVP finishes. the comparison isn't close dude.

[AussieSteve]

3ball can't contextualize stats. Or at least when it is related to Jordan in any way.

For example, in 1990, Barkley took 15 shots a game for his 25ppg. The same year, Jordan took 24 shots a game for his 33ppg.

Barkley's game was predicated on drawing a double in the post, or scoring if the double didn't come. All those doubles created opportunities for his team mates.

Jordan's offensive game was predicated on him being the best iso scorer in the league.

Barkley's game lends itself to team mates getting scoring opportunities. Jordan's game doesn't. Hence Barkley's Philly teammates all achieved career high scoring next to Barkley, while Jordan's team mates scored more when Jordan wasn't there.

[Kings2024Champs]

Well he is in finance out in vegas so hes good manipulating/working with numbers.

[Full Court]

I think Pippen was a much better player than 3ball give him credit for being. That aside, anyone who says Lebron James is the GOAT never actually watched Jordan play.

[Axe]

HEY OP HOWS YOUR BUISNESS GOING? HOWS YOUR HOME EQUITY GOING? HOWS YOUR WIFE AND KIDS GOING? NICE LIFE YIKES

[Axe]

I know op has only been posting in the otc mostly but now, he's trying to make some noise in the main forum on baldan stans that he hates.

[3ball]

3ball can't contextualize stats. Or at least when it is related to Jordan in any way.

For example, in 1990, Barkley took 15 shots a game for his 25ppg. The same year, Jordan took 24 shots a game for his 33ppg.

Barkley's game was predicated on drawing a double in the post, or scoring if the double didn't come. All those doubles created opportunities for his team mates.

Jordan's offensive game was predicated on him being the best iso scorer in the league.

Barkley's game lends itself to team mates getting scoring opportunities. Jordan's game doesn't. Hence Barkley's Philly teammates all achieved career high scoring next to Barkley, while Jordan's team mates scored more when Jordan wasn't there.

JR Smith averaged 18/8 on 66% true shooting while providing amazing spacing/driving lanes in the 15' ECF


WHEN DID PIPPEN PLAY MATERIALLY BETTER THAN THIS

that's the point about pippen - his caliber of play was achieved by..... everyone... even JR... it's a low bar, which makes him incredibly overrated.. he never played anywhere near top 30 caliber

[SATAN]

I think Pippen was a much better player than 3ball give him credit for being. That aside, anyone who says Lebron James is the GOAT never actually watched Jordan play.

I did and I have no problem with people saying LeBron is the goat. They have completely different styles and are/were both brilliant. It's not a big deal.

[And1AllDay]

He doesn't realize that other people have either watched or have the ability to watch all of these games.