Jokic is starting his GOAT run now

[Axe]

I don't understand how people say the current era is weak blah blah and then go and say Jokic is one the goats all of a sudden.

Jokic would be an afterthought if prime LeBron was in the league currently.

Both of them will be obsolete once wemby the giraffe starts thriving in the league, tho only if he can go without being hampered by injuries.

[StrongLurk]

To reiterate the other points that have been made, this thread was made after Jokic had already won b2b MVP's, and let's be real, he should've won 3 in a row if not for a late media push to give it to Embiid. He did this while putting up historically great production and advanced metrics 3 straight years. And this thread was made literally days after he had put up a 35/13/10 on 66%TS series against Phoenix. He also had a healthy team around him for the first time in years. I hate to break it to OP, but he's not going to get the credit he so clearly thinks he deserves for making this thread

No one else is claiming Jokic is on a GOAT path. I never made these threads for Curry or Giannis after their b2b MVPs.

I will die on this hill right now that Jokic will go down for sure as a top 10 and maybe even top 5 player of all time. If Magic Johnson can be considered a top 5 all time player while not being a good defender AND playing with Kareem his whole career, then Jokic can enter that space too.

[beasted]

Magic is far from a consensus top 5 player. The only consensus among the top 5 seems to be Kareem, Jordan, and LeBron, if you ask 80% of non-troll fans with common sense. From there, it is highly debatable and contested amongst Russell, Wilt, Magic, Bird, Malone, Shaq, Kobe, Duncan, Curry, etc.

So to use him as the benchmark is a bad argument.

[AlternativeAcc.]

No one else is claiming Jokic is on a GOAT path. I never made these threads for Curry or Giannis after their b2b MVPs.

I will die on this hill right now that Jokic will go down for sure as a top 10 and maybe even top 5 player of all time. If Magic Johnson can be considered a top 5 all time player while not being a good defender AND playing with Kareem his whole career, then Jokic can enter that space too.

He's already top 10 based off peak alone. Hell, he's already in my top 3. I'm a big peak guy. He and LeBron have the greatest peaks ever.

[SATAN]

Both of them will be obsolete once wemby the giraffe starts thriving in the league

Looks like Mikey will be out of the top 5 then if that happens

[Axe]

Looks like Mikey will be out of the top 5 then if that happens

Luka will take up his spot.

[StrongLurk]

32/12/7, 2 steals, no turnovers, 67 TS% in game 1.

Jokic is just head and shoulders above everyone in the NBA right now.

15 more wins and he is top ten all time.

[SouBeachTalents]

And NOBODY called it but OP

[StrongLurk]

And NOBODY called it but OP

So you expected Jokic to go back-to-back with rings/FMVPS? I didn't see any threads on that. I didn't see anyone in the media claim it either (they were actually hating Jokic and babying Embiid last year lol).

See my post below from when I made this thread (may 2023) and you'll understand why I waited on the "GOAT" run. It's only due to Jok's teammates finally be healthy last year.

"This run has been building over the last 3 years...but because NBA fans are stupid, they need to see Jokic win a ring first before giving him any legit credit. This is why I'm saying his GOAT run starts now, because the Nuggets will win the chip this year. I've been hyping Jokic up since his first playoff run in 2019 because it was clear he was a REAL superstar in the making. It's been obvious to see that he is the best player in basketball recently. People wanted to give that title to Giannis or even Curry because they won rings, but Jokic didn't have a healthy team to compete.

Then Jokic legit faced media-fueled racism this year because people wanted to coddle the crying Embiid. People wanted to say Embiid was better than Jokic even though Embiid has NEVER accomplished more than Jokic. Finally enough people are starting to face reality this year than Embiid can't compete with Jokic."

[BarberSchool]

I don’t think Jokic has a realistic path into the top 5 of all time.

Unless he wins 5 more titles, and continues his current statistical / advanced stats dominance for another 7-8 years.

I don’t think he has the motivation or physical nature to sustain his current play for that long.

[AlternativeAcc.]

I don’t think Jokic has a realistic path into the top 5 of all time.

Unless he wins 5 more titles, and continues his current statistical / advanced stats dominance for another 7-8 years.

I don’t think he has the motivation or physical nature to sustain his current play for that long.

5 more titles? What are you talking about. Another title or 2 and he already has a top 5 resume.

Dude is 29. His game doesn't rely on raw athleticim. What physical nature are you talking about?

[BarberSchool]

5 more titles? What are you talking about. Another title or 2 and he already has a top 5 resume.

Dude is 29. His game doesn't rely on raw athleticim. What physical nature are you talking about?

I’ve always been one to allude to the same thing you just did, that players who rely on athleticism like Westbrook, generally have very steep drop offs in ability and production in their mid 30’s.

2 titles wouldn’t put him in anyone’s top 5. He would be somewhere from 8-12 with a measly two titles. To get to #3, #4, he would need at least 4-5 total Chanpionships at this same level of dominance. To get to #2 he would need 6. He cannot surpass Jordan, unless he wins 7, all with the level of dominance he currently has, or very close to it for the last two.

I say “motivation” & “physical nature” because yes he seems durable, and you can’t really get feet under him since he stays on the floor, and doesn’t rely on athleticism, but …. I mean more that his dismissive nature about professional basketball, American culture, the NBA as a business… he doesn’t think that highly of it all, and this, will likely not stay super motivated to sustain his greatness for as long as he could, if he were more motivated, or if he had a body which had enough of a frame to sustain this even as it withered.

He doesn’t have much muscle mass, and while that helps him not get as tired at elevation as those with large volumes of muscle mass, it also means his joints and connective tissue take more of the wear and tear, instead of being supported by the skeletal muscle system. His flabby, loose, janky physical nature isn’t giving his hips, knees, and other joints as much support as they might want. And while his style of play hasn’t resulted in any significant injuries yet, I think he is at risk for such as time passes.

[FultzNationRISE]

I’ve always been one to allude to the same thing you just did, that players who rely on athleticism like Westbrook, generally have very steep drop offs in ability and production in their mid 30’s.

2 titles wouldn’t put him in anyone’s top 5. He would be somewhere from 8-12 with a measly two titles. To get to #3, #4, he would need at least 4-5 total Chanpionships at this same level of dominance. To get to #2 he would need 6. He cannot surpass Jordan, unless he wins 7, all with the level of dominance he currently has, or very close to it for the last two.

I say “motivation” & “physical nature” because yes he seems durable, and you can’t really get feet under him since he stays on the floor, and doesn’t rely on athleticism, but …. I mean more that his dismissive nature about professional basketball, American culture, the NBA as a business… he doesn’t think that highly of it all, and this, will likely not stay super motivated to sustain his greatness for as long as he could, if he were more motivated, or if he had a body which had enough of a frame to sustain this even as it withered.

He’ll be in mine.

And mine’s better than the collective “everyone’s.”

[SouBeachTalents]

I’ve always been one to allude to the same thing you just did, that players who rely on athleticism like Westbrook, generally have very steep drop offs in ability and production in their mid 30’s.

2 titles wouldn’t put him in anyone’s top 5. He would be somewhere from 8-12 with a measly two titles. To get to #3, #4, he would need at least 4-5 total Chanpionships at this same level of dominance. To get to #2 he would need 6. He cannot surpass Jordan, unless he wins 7, all with the level of dominance he currently has, or very close to it for the last two.

I say “motivation” & “physical nature” because yes he seems durable, and you can’t really get feet under him since he stays on the floor, and doesn’t rely on athleticism, but …. I mean more that his dismissive nature about professional basketball, American culture, the NBA as a business… he doesn’t think that highly of it all, and this, will likely not stay super motivated to sustain his greatness for as long as he could, if he were more motivated, or if he had a body which had enough of a frame to sustain this even as it withered.

He doesn’t have much muscle mass, and while that helps him not get as tired at elevation as those with large volumes of muscle mass, it also means his joints and connective tissue take more of the wear and tear, instead of being supported by the skeletal muscle system. His flabby, loose, janky physical nature isn’t giving his hips, knees, and other joints as much support as they might want. And while his style of play hasn’t resulted in any significant injuries yet, I think he is at risk for such as time passes.

You shouldn't rely on championships to this great an extent to rank players.

[BarberSchool]

You shouldn't rely on championships to this great an extent to rank players.

I don’t.
I have Barkley ranked much higher than most do, due to his insane peak in the late 80’s and early 90’s, and his uniqueness as a player and personality.

For Jokic tho, and his style of play, championships factor in more than they do for Sir Charles.